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Author Topic: Sing along with me.. "M-I-C-K-E-Y M-O-U-S-E"  (Read 3554 times)

Offline lkjohnson1950

Re: Sing along with me.. "M-I-C-K-E-Y M-O-U-S-E"
« Reply #15 on: May 23, 2010, 11:54:00 PM »
Doesn't sound like Ross!!

Lonny
Lonny

Offline monty

Re: Sing along with me.. "M-I-C-K-E-Y M-O-U-S-E"
« Reply #16 on: May 24, 2010, 12:47:11 PM »
The rule was clear to everyone (except Schumacher / Mercedes).
Yes I am biased against Schumacher but I honestly think this was a misplaced piece of opportunism on his part and then Ross was trying to justify Schumacher's actions after the event.
No radio transmissions have been offered and Mercedes are not going to appeal. If this was a 'team' decision I'm sure they would have lodged an appeal.

Offline Scott

Re: Sing along with me.. "M-I-C-K-E-Y M-O-U-S-E"
« Reply #17 on: May 24, 2010, 02:27:09 PM »
I am no so biased against MS, but I tend to agree with you Monty.  I think it was exactly that.  MS may or may not have known about that part of the rule, but he should have been told to hold his place across the line.  Even if he did know about the rule, I'd say it is in his nature to do it anyhow and deal with the consequences after the race.
The Honey Badger doesn't give a...

Offline John S

Re: Sing along with me.. "M-I-C-K-E-Y M-O-U-S-E"
« Reply #18 on: May 25, 2010, 02:23:12 PM »
So Ross and the Mercedes team claiming that some race officials had agreed that racing was possible because the course goes green after the safety car pulls in is just an invention to cover Michael's bum. I can't see the FIA could let that go uninvestigated.

The change in the rule about overtaking after the safety car line rather than the start finish line, which is new this year, is the complicating factor leaving enough doubt for some drivers, teams, and probably race officials, to misunderstand, or misinterpret, the end of race rule. As CD said originally Green means Go, in all the motor race series I know anyway, so IMO they should have finished with Yellow lights and flags then there would have been no doubt from anyone.

Still good to see Schumi is up for it though by trying it at the end.

I think you're wrong about pit lane speeding though CD, even the best of us get caught out keeping to speed limits. The punishments should be relative to the offence and as I for one think they set the pit lane limits far too low 10kmph over is a very small sin. I realise there are safety issues but I still think you can kill the sport by over doing the health and safety thing.





  
« Last Edit: May 25, 2010, 02:29:44 PM by John S »
Racing is life - everything else is just waiting. (Steve McQueen)

Offline Canada Darrell™

Re: Sing along with me.. "M-I-C-K-E-Y M-O-U-S-E"
« Reply #19 on: May 27, 2010, 03:41:28 AM »
I just watched the official F1 video recap of Monaco and Michael was clearly told to race to the line by his race director/dude/radio guy.

To me, 10km over a pit speed limit is a huge offence, and had it happened during the race he would have been surely penalized...although...given the lack of punishment handed down to Rubens for throwing his wheel out the cockpit who knows?  :D
Kimi's back! Future double WDC.

Offline lkjohnson1950

Re: Sing along with me.. "M-I-C-K-E-Y M-O-U-S-E"
« Reply #20 on: May 27, 2010, 05:07:03 AM »
Given that the loose manhole cover caused Rubens accident, maybe they thought they "owed" him one. 10 kph over the limit is a big offense, but what do you want, a 10 spot grid penalty? If he had done it in the race, he would have gotten a stop and go.
That's happened before.

Lonny
Lonny

Offline Canada Darrell™

Re: Sing along with me.. "M-I-C-K-E-Y M-O-U-S-E"
« Reply #21 on: May 27, 2010, 08:19:32 AM »
, but what do you want, a 10 spot grid penalty? If he had done it in the race, he would have gotten a stop and go.
That's happened before.

Lonny

No, I think a 10 place penalty would be excessive and yes, I know a drive-thru is the penaly during a race. The whole point of the thread was just me airing my opinion that the fines and punishment are not a deterrent to the offenders. You and I are at least in agreement that 10km is a lot and a serious offence......therefore a $2000 fine is NOT a serious deterrent to not do it again. Maybe they could start scaling the amount of the fine to your salary!  ::)

re: Rubens -  Wouldn't that cause a considerable flap if we ever heard of F1 not giving a fine or whatnot for a rules infraction because they felt sorry for them!
Kimi's back! Future double WDC.

Offline John S

Re: Sing along with me.. "M-I-C-K-E-Y M-O-U-S-E"
« Reply #22 on: May 27, 2010, 10:36:55 AM »
To me, 10km over a pit speed limit is a huge offence, and had it happened during the race he would have been surely penalized...although...given the lack of punishment handed down to Rubens for throwing his wheel out the cockpit who knows?  :D

The main reason for the seemingly harsher penalty of a drive thru or stop/go during the race is because the offender will have been deemed to have got an advantage on the other cars, similar to a jump start, not because it is considered a more unacceptably massive safety risk.

The Ruebens incident was a bad mistake both from him and by the stewards for lack of proper action, no matter what caused his crash the rules should be applied consistently, the excuse of running out of time is clearly just that - an excuse and a lame one at that.

Racing is life - everything else is just waiting. (Steve McQueen)

Offline Scott

Re: Sing along with me.. "M-I-C-K-E-Y M-O-U-S-E"
« Reply #23 on: May 27, 2010, 10:54:28 AM »
You and I are at least in agreement that 10km is a lot and a serious offence......therefore a $2000 fine is NOT a serious deterrent to not do it again. Maybe they could start scaling the amount of the fine to your salary!  ::)

I got a ticket just this morning on a quiet country road.  6km over and it cost me Sfr 100.- (about the same in CDN or US).  It's not going to break me, but I'll probably think twice when going down that same stretch of road.  If they had fined me $500.-, there would be no way I'd ever do it again.

Now my salary is a tiny fraction of Mark's...I'd say $20-50k would be more appropriate for him doing 10k over if they want him to be sure to never do it again.
The Honey Badger doesn't give a...

Offline John S

Re: Sing along with me.. "M-I-C-K-E-Y M-O-U-S-E"
« Reply #24 on: May 27, 2010, 11:15:13 AM »

I got a ticket just this morning on a quiet country road.  6km over and it cost me Sfr 100.- (about the same in CDN or US).  It's not going to break me, but I'll probably think twice when going down that same stretch of road.  If they had fined me $500.-, there would be no way I'd ever do it again.

Now my salary is a tiny fraction of Mark's...I'd say $20-50k would be more appropriate for him doing 10k over if they want him to be sure to never do it again.

Sorry to hear about the fine Scott, bet you feel a bit like Ruebens did after his shunt I know I would. Sure massive punishments for small misdemeaners will have a huge detterent effect, if you use a prison stretch for parking in bus lanes no one would do it, - or would some still try it?. :DntKnw:

Only trouble is how you going to deal with the more serious offences, take away and sell their cars, what next their houses or businesses? :confused:


Racing is life - everything else is just waiting. (Steve McQueen)

Offline Scott

Re: Sing along with me.. "M-I-C-K-E-Y M-O-U-S-E"
« Reply #25 on: May 27, 2010, 12:52:28 PM »
No, I don't mean that...what I'm saying is that a $100 fine based on my income (and incidentally for 15kph over or more in Switzerland they fine you in relation to your income) is just barely a deterrent - I'm glad it wasn't more, but had it been $500, you can bet that I wouldn't speed anywhere.  For Mark, based on his income, assuming he actually personally has to pay it, his fine is a drop in the bucket and not much of a deterrent at all.

I guess the question I'm getting at is what is a real deterrent to pit lane speeding.  I think it is safe to say we all agree that it's dangerous enough on pit lane, the last thing we need is anyone going too fast (which is a different question entirely - some of us think the limit is too low).  So do we even know if the driver digs out his own wallet to pay these fines, or does he just hand the paperwork over to the team?  If that is the case, then maybe grid drops are more appropriate.  If it's not the case, then maybe it should be assessed based on the driver's income, and make it sting.
The Honey Badger doesn't give a...

Offline lkjohnson1950

Re: Sing along with me.. "M-I-C-K-E-Y M-O-U-S-E"
« Reply #26 on: May 27, 2010, 05:24:16 PM »
Most driver salaries are carefully guarded secrets, though we can ballpark 'em. Unless it is a massive fine, they will shrug it off. If speeding is truly considered serious, perhaps a grid penalty is appropriate. Even 2 spots would give a driver pause.

Lonny
Lonny

Offline Alianora La Canta

Re: Sing along with me.. "M-I-C-K-E-Y M-O-U-S-E"
« Reply #27 on: May 28, 2010, 09:29:18 PM »
Usually the driver hands the fine over to the team when it comes to fines of any sort. You know the team is about to fire a driver when it hands the fine back (Spyker did this after Christijan Albers got a $10000 fine for doing an aero test with the team's fuel hose, and two races later Markus Winklehock was in the car instead.)
Percussus resurgio
@lacanta (Twitter)
http://alianoralacanta.tumblr.com (Blog/Tumblr)

 


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