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Author Topic: Maldonado  (Read 3637 times)

Offline stealthhaggis

Re: Maldonado
« Reply #15 on: September 02, 2011, 03:59:12 PM »
100% Maldoados fault, if you did that on the open road and wee caught you would be penalised for dangerous driving possibly even banned.

Offline Alianora La Canta

Re: Maldonado
« Reply #16 on: September 03, 2011, 10:45:41 PM »
Unusually I do not agree with Ali
Also I think there is some misunderstanding of which 'coming together' we are talking about.
During the quali session Maldonado's lap had been ruined by what was going on in front of him. Lewis was still at a good pace and Maldonado should have made sure he kept out of the way. Instead Maldonado tried to fight and almost blocked Lewis.
I think this is what we are refering tom as the 'first coming together'.

Pastor was also on his fastest lap at that point. Both were entitled to the rights someone on their "hot lap" can expect, which was of course something of a problem as there was insufficient track to enable both of them to have them.

For me Pastor was still the one in the wrong - once he was pressured/allowed himself to be pressured off-line, he should have stayed there. He must have known that attempting to turn in would cause a crash, which is why I reckon this was deliberate.

At the end of the session, I suspect that Lewis slowed down to 'wave' to Maldonado to let him know that he wasn't happy. As I said, I do think that initially he deliberately 'jinked' right as part of his 'wave' but he definitely wasn't doing anything dangerous.
After that Lewis did not put in any steering input but Maldonado steered left and hit the Maclaren. Definitely Maldonado's fault and I think, deliberate.

Firstly, the "wave" isn't universally recognised as meaning anything, so attempting it was risky. Secondly, Lewis connected in the "wave". Either Lewis was not in sufficient control of his car or he deliberately crashed. Pastor had to steer left a bit to regain control of his car afterwards and Lewis didn't give him space to do so. What exactly was Lewis expecting to happen?
Percussus resurgio
@lacanta (Twitter)
http://alianoralacanta.tumblr.com (Blog/Tumblr)

Offline Ian

Re: Maldonado
« Reply #17 on: September 04, 2011, 12:47:43 AM »
Lewis did not deliberately crash, Maldonado crashed into Lewis deliberately and should have been D/Q'd from the race.
An aircraft landing is just a controlled crash.

Offline John S

Re: Maldonado
« Reply #18 on: September 04, 2011, 11:12:06 AM »

Whilst I agree Pastor did run his car into lewis and it may or may not have been deliberate, it looked intentional to me. I am however mindful that he, Maldonado, is still in his rookie season and therefore a D/Q would be way too much. A very heavy but suspended penalty of some sort, if the stewards suspect malicious behaviour, seems the best way to improve manners and sportsmanship in such circumstances.

Leaving aside any question of motivation there was still an avoidable, and wholly unnecessary, accident; so whoever is judged to have caused it should have got at least a 10 place grid drop IMHO.

   
Racing is life - everything else is just waiting. (Steve McQueen)

Offline stealthhaggis

Re: Maldonado
« Reply #19 on: September 05, 2011, 09:28:34 AM »

Firstly, the "wave" isn't universally recognised as meaning anything, so attempting it was risky. Secondly, Lewis connected in the "wave". Either Lewis was not in sufficient control of his car or he deliberately crashed. Pastor had to steer left a bit to regain control of his car afterwards and Lewis didn't give him space to do so. What exactly was Lewis expecting to happen?
Sorry but that is incorrect. Lewis did not connect in his weave, Maldonado connected in his aggressive move left. The video evidence is against you on that one. You can clearly see Maldonado move sharply to the left and during this movement he hits Lewis. That you are denying what is actually shown on video evidence is bizarre. It has even been said by the FIA that Lewis made no such movement at the time of the collision, Maldonado caused the crash. How anyone can defend that action is beyond me. Did you defend Schumacher the same way when he tried to put Rubens in the wall last season? Was that Rubens fault for being there as well?!  :DD

Offline Alianora La Canta

Re: Maldonado
« Reply #20 on: September 06, 2011, 01:42:52 PM »

Firstly, the "wave" isn't universally recognised as meaning anything, so attempting it was risky. Secondly, Lewis connected in the "wave". Either Lewis was not in sufficient control of his car or he deliberately crashed. Pastor had to steer left a bit to regain control of his car afterwards and Lewis didn't give him space to do so. What exactly was Lewis expecting to happen?
Sorry but that is incorrect. Lewis did not connect in his weave, Maldonado connected in his aggressive move left. The video evidence is against you on that one. You can clearly see Maldonado move sharply to the left and during this movement he hits Lewis. That you are denying what is actually shown on video evidence is bizarre. It has even been said by the FIA that Lewis made no such movement at the time of the collision, Maldonado caused the crash. How anyone can defend that action is beyond me. Did you defend Schumacher the same way when he tried to put Rubens in the wall last season? Was that Rubens fault for being there as well?!  :DD

It was the video evidence I used to come to my assessment. The sharp left was a response to being hit mid-"wave". Hence the Schumacher analogy doesn't work and the sentence about "that you are denying what is actually shown on video evidence is bizarre" is one I have been wondering of others.

Summary: I expected better - much better - from the pair of them.
Percussus resurgio
@lacanta (Twitter)
http://alianoralacanta.tumblr.com (Blog/Tumblr)

Offline monty

Re: Maldonado
« Reply #21 on: September 12, 2011, 01:57:00 PM »
Quote
It was the video evidence I used to come to my assessment. The sharp left was a response to being hit mid-"wave". Hence the Schumacher analogy doesn't work and the sentence about "that you are denying what is actually shown on video evidence is bizarre" is one I have been wondering of others.

It is probably time to 'agree to disagree' except........you are wrong!

I also looked at the video. Hamilton did 'jink right'. It was a stupid, petulant thing to do but he did not even come close to making contact. He then continued in a straight line well over to the left of the track. Maldonado then steered (i.e. deliberately turned the steering wheel) to the left. Only then was there any contact.
Maldonado could have continued straight, or better still, moved slightly to the right to keep away from an extremely upset Hamilton but he chose to steer left.
Therefore, the crash (irrespective of other stupid & emotional reactions) was completely the fault of Maldonado.

 


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