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Author Topic: Bahrain in Cartoon  (Read 4301 times)

Offline lkjohnson1950



Lonny

vintly

  • Guest
Re: Bahrain in Cartoon
« Reply #1 on: April 10, 2012, 02:09:50 PM »
Good one. Here's another. Glad to be reading here and there that it probably won't happen, but if Bernie forcers it through it'll be the worst thing he's done in a long while.

http://twitpic.com/96vo3s

No to Bahrain!

Offline Jericoke

Re: Bahrain in Cartoon
« Reply #2 on: April 10, 2012, 03:11:12 PM »
While I don't agree with racing in a country experience turmoil, the FIA and FOM are trying to be non political (outside their own domain), which is admirable. 

If lives are at risk, that rules out the Brazilian Grand Prix, doesn't it?

USA, Britain and Germany are actively at war with Afghanistan.  Is that a reason to cancel their races?

Is a protest at the track reason to cancel?  Any country is going to have a group of people protesting an F1 race.

If it's up to Bernie to decide who can legitimately operate and GP and who cannot, I don't see how that makes the sport better, even if it means coming down on the wrong side of history once in a while.

vintly

  • Guest
Re: Bahrain in Cartoon
« Reply #3 on: April 10, 2012, 06:34:46 PM »
While I don't agree with racing in a country experience turmoil, the FIA and FOM are trying to be non political (outside their own domain), which is admirable. 

If lives are at risk, that rules out the Brazilian Grand Prix, doesn't it?

USA, Britain and Germany are actively at war with Afghanistan.  Is that a reason to cancel their races?

Is a protest at the track reason to cancel?  Any country is going to have a group of people protesting an F1 race.

If it's up to Bernie to decide who can legitimately operate and GP and who cannot, I don't see how that makes the sport better, even if it means coming down on the wrong side of history once in a while.

There is an active crackdown on democracy in Bahrain. The majority Shia population are not being allowed to protest – instead they're being shot at or locked up. Bernie and the Al Khalifa family (who are effectively King and government) choose to paint a different picture to what's really going on, as they think it will pull the wool over peoples' eyes. Unfortunately for them, most people aren't fooled, hence the concerns, and overwhelming feeling that it shouldn't go ahead.

I think staging a Grand Prix at this stage would essentially condone what's going on, and that's not right. It's not about F1, it's bigger than that.

Offline cosworth151

Re: Bahrain in Cartoon
« Reply #4 on: April 10, 2012, 06:59:31 PM »
I agree. F1 should not put itself in support of despots.
“You can search the world over for the finer things, but you won't find a match for the American road and the creatures that live on it.”
― Bob Dylan

Offline Ian

Re: Bahrain in Cartoon
« Reply #5 on: April 10, 2012, 07:02:48 PM »
Lets face it, it's one despot supporting another despot.
An aircraft landing is just a controlled crash.

Offline John S

Re: Bahrain in Cartoon
« Reply #6 on: April 10, 2012, 09:03:04 PM »

There is an active crackdown on democracy in Bahrain. The majority Shia population are not being allowed to protest – instead they're being shot at or locked up. Bernie and the Al Khalifa family (who are effectively King and government) choose to paint a different picture to what's really going on, as they think it will pull the wool over peoples' eyes. Unfortunately for them, most people aren't fooled, hence the concerns, and overwhelming feeling that it shouldn't go ahead.

I think staging a Grand Prix at this stage would essentially condone what's going on, and that's not right. It's not about F1, it's bigger than that.

That's a pretty simplistic view I think, the political reforms that started in the 90's and gathered speed early in the noughties seem to have been hijacked by religious factions. For instance, Womens rights, their freedom to vote and their ability to stand for election to national political office, all of which were enshrined in law in the early noughties, have been totally trodden down by religious zealots and by Shia followers in particular.
In my opinion the present intafada is more about imposing a religious state in place of the constitutional monarchy, rather than working for human rights.

Bahrain also has the freest economy in the Middle East and is tenth freest overall in the world based on the 2011 Index of Economic Freedom (published by the Heritage Foundation/Wall Street Journal).

Set against the record of most other regimes in the Middle East & Africa, the Kingdom of Bahrain looks more democratic than a lot of Western countries.

F1 is sport and should not involve itself in National politics - the decision to go or not should be solely on grounds of safety, and as Jeri has already said Brazil is probably a much more dangerous race weekend for team members.

 



      
« Last Edit: April 10, 2012, 09:08:08 PM by John S »
Racing is life - everything else is just waiting. (Steve McQueen)

Offline cosworth151

Re: Bahrain in Cartoon
« Reply #7 on: April 10, 2012, 10:14:20 PM »
It appears that King Hamad is opposed by most of his people and most international human rights groups, and supported by Bernie Ecclestone (FOM) and Rupert Murdoch (Heritage Foundation/Wall Street Journal/News of the World).

A poll in the current F1 Racing show that 60% of respondents Oppose or Strongly Oppose the race going ahead.

In any case does F1 really need to show up in the middle of someone else's civil war? Do a few Brazilian footpads really compare to being in the middle of someone else's civil war? The race would just be a juicy, high value target televised live to the entire world.
« Last Edit: April 10, 2012, 10:16:40 PM by cosworth151 »
“You can search the world over for the finer things, but you won't find a match for the American road and the creatures that live on it.”
― Bob Dylan

Offline PG_Gabriel

Re: Bahrain in Cartoon
« Reply #8 on: April 11, 2012, 01:49:28 AM »
I hate to see a race canceled, but without a doubt it is for the better. I just wish they had a replacement ready. Magny Cours? Paul Ricard? Nurbergring? Istanbul?

Offline lkjohnson1950

Re: Bahrain in Cartoon
« Reply #9 on: April 11, 2012, 04:13:52 AM »
At least one protest group has announced that they intend to target the GP. Whether that means laying down in front of trucks or tossing hand grenades wasn't specified.
Lonny

vintly

  • Guest
Re: Bahrain in Cartoon
« Reply #10 on: April 11, 2012, 09:26:30 AM »

That's a pretty simplistic view I think, the political reforms that started in the 90's and gathered speed early in the noughties seem to have been hijacked by religious factions. For instance, Womens rights, their freedom to vote and their ability to stand for election to national political office, all of which were enshrined in law in the early noughties, have been totally trodden down by religious zealots and by Shia followers in particular.
In my opinion the present intafada is more about imposing a religious state in place of the constitutional monarchy, rather than working for human rights.

Bahrain also has the freest economy in the Middle East and is tenth freest overall in the world based on the 2011 Index of Economic Freedom (published by the Heritage Foundation/Wall Street Journal).

Set against the record of most other regimes in the Middle East & Africa, the Kingdom of Bahrain looks more democratic than a lot of Western countries.

F1 is sport and should not involve itself in National politics - the decision to go or not should be solely on grounds of safety, and as Jeri has already said Brazil is probably a much more dangerous race weekend for team members.


It's a simplistic view because it's a simple question - of whether now is the right TIME to stage a GP in Bahrain.

It's got nothing to do with 90s politics, nor would any sporting event to be held in 2012, it's not that complex. It's about whether staging a GP would make any difference to the people of Bahrain. I think it would send a message condoning what's going on there, which for the majority of people in Bahrain would be a negative.

In reference to the safety issue, I agree that in an ideal situation, safety should be the primary concern when deciding whether to host a GP. In this case it's past that already - there are bigger things happening in the country. Of course, if it goes ahead, there would be a doubling of military presence, if not tripling, even tighter controls on 'the masses' and everyone involved in the GP would be safe - it's the safety of the Bahranians, not the damn GP team members that counts!!!

Offline John S

Re: Bahrain in Cartoon
« Reply #11 on: April 11, 2012, 11:01:18 AM »
It appears that King Hamad is opposed by most of his people and most international human rights groups,


I think you'll find most human rights groups oppose a lot of what the US and British governments get up to as well.

Bahrain is a constitutional monarchy and has a 2 house system of government, one appointed council and one elected council. Err.. let me think that sounds mighty familiar to us Brits, yes I know it's the non elected that have a bigger say in Bahrain, but it's still better democracy than most Mid East states.  

A lot of what is going on is more about differing religious factions, Sunni and Shī'a Islamists, struggling for power at the expense of the more tolerant liberal sections of the population.

It appears that more power has been welded in the states name by religious leaders than the King. Indeed it was the path towards to democracy with elections to government in 2006 that led to the religious parties starting to dominate Bahraini politics.

Almost every country detains political prisoners of one sort or another, it seems to depend largely on media views whether such detentions are good or bad - or indeed justified or not.

If we call it civil war when there is heavy coordinated opposition, sometimes violent, towards their own government, then I guess half the world is in a state of civil war.

In my opinion it is a mistake to think the Bahraini situation is remotely similar to what is taking place in Syria. I feel the situation has more in common with China and how they deal with disaffected groups, no sign of the Chinese GP not taking place though.    

So unless we want all sporting events around the world to be at the mercy of protesters, militants or fundamentalists of any kind, the race should go on.

    

« Last Edit: April 11, 2012, 11:04:20 AM by John S »
Racing is life - everything else is just waiting. (Steve McQueen)

Offline cosworth151

Re: Bahrain in Cartoon
« Reply #12 on: April 11, 2012, 12:05:29 PM »
I can't think of a single established, main stream human rights group that claims that the current government of the U.S. is not legitimate. Bahrain, on the other hand, follows the advice of another "constitutional" leader, Josef Stalin: ""Those who cast the votes decide nothing. Those who count the votes decide everything."

You compare the Bahraini government to that of the U.K. King Hamad still has absolute power. He can override the legislature on anything at any time for any reason. The Bahraini legislature more closely resembles the North Korean Supreme People's Assembly than it does the U.K. Parliament or U.S. Congress.

I do agree with you about the Chinese GP. It should go away, too.
“You can search the world over for the finer things, but you won't find a match for the American road and the creatures that live on it.”
― Bob Dylan

Offline John S

Re: Bahrain in Cartoon
« Reply #13 on: April 11, 2012, 06:37:30 PM »

Jackie Stewart adds his support for the Bahrain GP to go ahead. I believe JYS is right and sport must not become a political pawn.



Racing is life - everything else is just waiting. (Steve McQueen)

Offline Jericoke

Re: Bahrain in Cartoon
« Reply #14 on: April 11, 2012, 07:27:42 PM »

Jackie Stewart adds his support for the Bahrain GP to go ahead. I believe JYS is right and sport must not become a political pawn.


F1 might be wrong for doing business in Bahrain in the first place, but it would be wrong to back down now.

Worst case scenario... everyone who thinks a race in Bahrain was a bad idea is right, and the (sporting) world is keenly focused on what a disaster the country is.  That would be a good thing, wouldn't it?

 


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