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Author Topic: H & Z Hungarian GP  (Read 1310 times)

Offline Scott

H & Z Hungarian GP
« on: July 29, 2018, 07:24:15 PM »
  • Publish
  • Well, I guess we get to spend the summer break debating if Bottas should keep his job or maybe offer it up to Ricciardo.  Seriously, that was shameful.  First Vettel and then Ricciardo?  Like a Rookie in a panic.  Or wingman in a panic?  Thanks Toto, that was a good one.

    Heroes

    Lewis managed a perfect race, only disappointment was when he took off his helmet to expose that silly haircut and something new and glittery stuck through his eyebrow.  Honestly I couldn’t care a less what he wants to paint or poke his body with, just that it made me go “Ew”.

    Vettel might have had a chance if his 5second pit stop was only 3, like it was supposed to be.  I think the Ferrari’s had the speed at the end of the race, if only there had been another 10 laps.

    Kimi. Can anyone explain to me why Ferrari would want to replace Kimi with ANYONE?  He just keeps showing up and proving he can take it to Vettel almost every race if the car or pit crew doesn’t let him down.  Today he almost had 2nd and was clearly faster than Vettel for the the last half of the race.  Post race I think that was the first time I’ve ever seen his better half or his son - it was great to see Kimi nearby someone he actually cares about. 

    Max’s Renault engine for letting go so Ricciardo could have a bit of good luck for a change and claw back ahead of Max.  A fantastic race for Daniel.

    Great races for Gasly and Magnussen and a few more in the midfield, but except for Bottas and his keep position or crash tactics, the race needed to be fast forwarded a bit.

    Bottas was the biggest and only notable Zero for me.
    « Last Edit: July 29, 2018, 07:28:07 PM by Scott »


    The Honey Badger doesn't give a...

    Offline Dare

    Re: H & Z Hungarian GP
    « Reply #1 on: July 29, 2018, 08:14:51 PM »
  • Publish
  • Agree about Kimi,he's having a great year that could be better
    if the powers to be let him. I wouldn't care if Lewis put a plate
    in his lips. I's really like to see Perez get a shot at a top team
    "The
    democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those
    who are
    willing to work and give to those who would not."
    --
    Thomas
    Jefferson

    Offline Jericoke

    Re: H & Z Hungarian GP
    « Reply #2 on: July 30, 2018, 04:05:23 AM »
  • Publish
  • I think Bottas did his job.  Vettel cut him off, because of those useless mirrors, and Ricciardo should have been warned that Bottas's car wouldn't be able to keep a racing line. 

    Bottas's job was to be tough for Vettel to pass, which he did to a T, and got punted for it.

    Maybe Bottas shouldn't have fought Daniel so hard, knowing it was inevitable, but then he'd take flack for giving up when things got tough, so I don't blame him for making things difficult.  Ricciardo should have been more patient to avoid contact.  Given how rough we are on Max for being impatient, we can also blame Seb and Daniel for the same flaw.

    But in a fairly straight forward race, maybe Bottas is the closest thing we have to a zero.

    That and whatever reason we lost two Renault powered cars.

    Offline rmassart

    Re: H & Z Hungarian GP
    « Reply #3 on: July 30, 2018, 06:14:35 AM »
  • Publish
  • I rate Bottas as a Hero, not a Zero. His drive was exceptional, keeping Vettel at bay on worn tyres for a good 25 laps I think.  Whilst possibly more at fault than the other driver I rate both his accidents as racing incidents. The second he should just have given in earlier as it was clear Ricciardo was quicker and Vettel was by then long gone. The first he got squeezed a little by Vettel and lost control after hitting the curb. I think Vettel took a huge risk turning across so sharply. He had tyres to drive 5 meters around Bottas but chose to cut right in front. Not his fault that he got punted, but a huge risk when fighting for the title.

    Zeros: Ferrari. A botched pit stop and, worse, poor strategy. Making Vettel weave through 5 or 6 back markers and then bringing him in immediately without giving him a chance to build up a cushion to Bottas again was just very poor. Either call him in just before he hits traffic (and risk the ultras being worn out by a longer stint) or else wait until Bottas hits the same traffic. The softs would presumably have lasted a few more laps.

    Offline Robem64

    Re: H & Z Hungarian GP
    « Reply #4 on: July 30, 2018, 07:39:53 AM »
  • Publish
  • Kimi. Can anyone explain to me why Ferrari would want to replace Kimi with ANYONE?  He just keeps showing up and proving he can take it to Vettel almost every race if the car or pit crew doesn’t let him down.  Today he almost had 2nd and was clearly faster than Vettel for the the last half of the race.  Post race I think that was the first time I’ve ever seen his better half or his son - it was great to see Kimi nearby someone he actually cares about. 

    And to do all that without a drink either!

    Zeros: Ferrari for forgetting to connect Kimi's drink up!
    "I'm not a pessimist, I'm an optimist with experience"

    Offline lkjohnson1950

    Re: H & Z Hungarian GP
    « Reply #5 on: July 30, 2018, 07:42:59 AM »
  • Publish
  • I rate Bottas as a Hero, not a Zero. His drive was exceptional, keeping Vettel at bay on worn tyres for a good 25 laps I think.  Whilst possibly more at fault than the other driver I rate both his accidents as racing incidents. The second he should just have given in earlier as it was clear Ricciardo was quicker and Vettel was by then long gone. The first he got squeezed a little by Vettel and lost control after hitting the curb. I think Vettel took a huge risk turning across so sharply. He had tyres to drive 5 meters around Bottas but chose to cut right in front. Not his fault that he got punted, but a huge risk when fighting for the title.

    Zeros: Ferrari. A botched pit stop and, worse, poor strategy. Making Vettel weave through 5 or 6 back markers and then bringing him in immediately without giving him a chance to build up a cushion to Bottas again was just very poor. Either call him in just before he hits traffic (and risk the ultras being worn out by a longer stint) or else wait until Bottas hits the same traffic. The softs would presumably have lasted a few more laps.

    I agree. Even Hamilton said he probably wouldn't have won without Bottas holding off Seb.
    Lonny

    Online Luke

    Re: H & Z Hungarian GP
    « Reply #6 on: July 30, 2018, 10:33:27 AM »
  • Publish
  • Heroes:
    Daniel Ricciardo- For providing some entertainment with his overtakes.

    Hamilton- For winning a race that he had no real right to win given the relative pace of the Mercs v the Ferraris. 

    Sergio Perez- For being able to race despite the 'other stuff' going on around him

    Zeroes:

    Ferrari/Vettel certainly seem to be veering towards their 2017 title throw away form which is alarming for them.  Again you would argue they have (at this moment in time) the fastest car yet they are trailing Hamilton again.  They were so on the ball early in the season with strategy that yesterday seemed bizarre.

    Bottas- He did have a good race at times, but I do think he was optimistic on Vettel (The Ferrari was ahead, you would expect Seb to shut the door but I do consider this more of a racing incident) and really shouldn't have pushed so hard against Ricciardo, especially on the one part of the circuit where overtakes are a possibility. 

    Williams- Again my favourite team stank.     
    « Last Edit: July 30, 2018, 10:35:11 AM by Luke »
    Poster formerly known as Williamsfan.

    Offline Scott

    Re: H & Z Hungarian GP
    « Reply #7 on: July 30, 2018, 11:13:47 AM »
  • Publish
  • I don’t fault Bottas for doing everything he could to keep both Seb & DR behind, but both times contact was avoidable.  Seb had to turn in at some point and was 95% past Bottas at the apex - the corner was his to take.  On DR, Ricciardo gave Bottas a truck’s width to play with yet Bottas decided to late brake even though he knew his tires were shot and front wing damaged.  I don’t rate that kind of move as a hero.  If it had been Grosjean everyone would have been screaming about it.
    The Honey Badger doesn't give a...

    Offline monty

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    Re: H & Z Hungarian GP
    « Reply #8 on: July 30, 2018, 11:57:58 AM »
  • Publish
  • Difficult to list H's and Z's.
    The race was good (makes a change).
    Hamilton was amazing in Qualifying and I honestly believe he had the speed to hold off Vettel even it the Ferrari pit stop hadn't lost Seb 2 seconds.
    I felt sorry for Bottas - he was forced onto a strategy to cover Kimi which ruined his race. I do think that the contact with Vettel was all Vettel's fault but it was just a racing incident and there was no way Bottas could have held him off much longer. Having said that, Bottas should have given up against Ricciardo. He knew the car was injured and that Ricciardo was much faster.
    Ricciardo drove a fantastic race. Kimi did a great job. Alonso was fun to watch again.  The Haas cars got in the points despite a bad strategy. Gasly showed why a lot of people are talking about his future.

    Online cosworth151

    Re: H & Z Hungarian GP
    « Reply #9 on: July 30, 2018, 05:12:39 PM »
  • Publish
  • Heroes:

    Danny Ric: A great charge up through the field.

    Quali: I didn't get to watch it until Sunday morning. Outstanding!

    Zeroes:

    Not Bottas: I'm going to give him a pass on both the Vettel & Ricciardo bumps. If anyone was at fault for the first, it was Vettel. On the second, I don't think he'd fully realized how much front downforce he'd lost with the wing damage. The front end just wouldn't turn.

    Ferrari pit crew: For Kimi's drinks bottle & Seb's overly long pit stop that let Bottas get by.
    “You can search the world over for the finer things, but you won't find a match for the American road and the creatures that live on it.”
    ― Bob Dylan

    Offline Robem64

    Re: H & Z Hungarian GP
    « Reply #10 on: July 30, 2018, 09:28:50 PM »
  • Publish
  • Having read this then maybe Ericsson should be classed as a hero in many races - especially the really hot ones.
    No drinks bottle for the last two years - to save weight. Now that's dedication to the cause.

    https://wtf1.com/post/ericsson-has-raced-without-a-drinks-bottle-in-his-car-for-two-years/
    "I'm not a pessimist, I'm an optimist with experience"

    Offline Scott

    Re: H & Z Hungarian GP
    « Reply #11 on: July 31, 2018, 10:42:39 AM »
  • Publish
  • An opinion that is similar, if more detailed, than mine...Mercedes tactics?  Hmmm  :tease:

    https://www.bbc.com/sport/formula1/45000927
    The Honey Badger doesn't give a...

    Offline John S

    Re: H & Z Hungarian GP
    « Reply #12 on: July 31, 2018, 11:06:25 AM »
  • Publish
  • Heroes:


    Gasly, superb drive after a really good quali effort. Top marks to Honda as well as both STR cars still running at race end.


    McLaren strategy dept, surprised most of the mid-fielders and probably themselves with the overcut. Had nothing to lose by trying something different and boy did it pay off.


    Bottas, kept Vettel neutralised for so much of the race allowed a straightforward win for Lewis, always compromised by his team using him to cover off Kimi with much too early stop. Fought on until he got the now infamous Vettel chop (ask Webber about Seb's sudden squeezing lunges after a pass, unsporting to say the least or is it worse, a Grosjeanesque lack of spatial awareness?).
    Yes I do think the chop was deliberate and totally stupid, Seb was lucky not to get a puncture, I wonder how many like me wish he had?  ;) 
    The incident with Danny Ric was a racing incident in my book, Dan's team will have told him that Bottas was wounded and encouraged him to attack as Valtteri was losing so much time. Experienced racers know wounded cars whilst easier targets are unpredictable and caution is the byword, trying to run right round the outside, instead of holding back for the switchback Danny put himself in harm's way. With heavily worn tyres and wing damage on Bottas' car natural physics did the rest.  :D


    Zeros:


    Ferrari and Seb, whilst Macca strategy was ace some one at the prancing horse got it very wrong, why leave Seb out to lap cars and lose time????? Seb himself for nearly throwing away his 2nd place by chopping across Valtteri's bow so suddenly, could have been puncture or even DNF - why take such stupid risk.  :crazy:

    Red Bull, for once again savaging Renault in public not once but twice, Christian you should be ashamed of yourself. Max's outburst is a little more understandable, he was in a good race position when he DNF'd.


    Force India and Williams, come on dudes I know Hungary isn't a good track for Merc but you can hardly blame your lowly finishing positions onto the Merc engine, you build the flaming cars yourselves.
    Hey maybe that's the answer - incinerate your present cars and start again. Oh no wait - one of you is already nearly bust financially starting over will probably finish the other as well.  :D

    STR strategy dept, poor old Brendan got out manoeuvred by some of the other teams using the strategy chosen by his team. The only bright spot the team can't blame him if they put him on a slower race time strategy than the cars around him.


     

             
    Racing is life - everything else is just waiting. (Steve McQueen)

    Offline Scott

    Re: H & Z Hungarian GP
    « Reply #13 on: July 31, 2018, 04:41:35 PM »
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  • Come on, that was nothing like the chop Vettel did on Webber, no way you can compare it, back in the days when Vettel behaved like Max. 

    Nobody knew the condition of Bottas’ car better than Bottas, why is it the job of other teams and drivers to tip toe around him??  Vettel was on the race line while Bottas was never going to successfully complete a late braking maneuver.  Ricciardo passed on the outside with plenty of room for Bottas to even competitively go through the corner with him, again, as long as he wasn’t planning to run deep.  Heaping praise on Bottas after two crashes that he caused is bizarre.
    The Honey Badger doesn't give a...

    Online Luke

    Re: H & Z Hungarian GP
    « Reply #14 on: July 31, 2018, 06:25:50 PM »
  • Publish
  • I totally agree Scott.  Bottas just got so ragged at the end of the race that I cannot blame Vettel or Ricciardo at all.  Whilst the first incident was more racing incident in my eyes, the move on Ricciardo was just madness and the FIA agreed hence his penalty. 
    Poster formerly known as Williamsfan.