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Author Topic: 2020 Eifel Grand Prix - Heroes and Zeroes  (Read 4449 times)

Offline jimclark

Re: 2020 Eifel Grand Prix - Heroes and Zeroes
« Reply #15 on: October 16, 2020, 06:32:10 AM »
Is a reasonable expectation for it to be fighting for that last point (in which case Leclerc's definitely punching above its weight?) Is it reasonable to expect top 8s on a typical day (in which case Vettel's seriously underdriving it?) Or is it somewhere in between, in which case the "configured to dominant driver" becomes a reasonable hypothesis?

As stated previously, I don't believe in "punching above a cars weight". There is no BoPing in F1 so every car is in the same "weight" class. The 17 times a Ferrari has finished (of a possible 22) this year, they have been in the points 11 times; in the top 8 eight times. Make what you will of those figures.  :confused:  :D
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jimclark

Offline John S

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Re: 2020 Eifel Grand Prix - Heroes and Zeroes
« Reply #16 on: October 16, 2020, 12:47:17 PM »
Is a reasonable expectation for it to be fighting for that last point (in which case Leclerc's definitely punching above its weight?) Is it reasonable to expect top 8s on a typical day (in which case Vettel's seriously underdriving it?) Or is it somewhere in between, in which case the "configured to dominant driver" becomes a reasonable hypothesis?

As stated previously, I don't believe in "punching above a cars weight". There is no BoPing in F1 so every car is in the same "weight" class. The 17 times a Ferrari has finished (of a possible 22) this year, they have been in the points 11 times; in the top 8 eight times. Make what you will of those figures.  :confused:  :D

So if I've got this right you believe Charles is a better driver than Seb, at this point in time at least, since both cars are equal.  Assuming they have no malfunctions.

Now is this because Seb has passed his best and Charles is in the golden zone of his prowess, or is it perhaps because this car suits young Leclerc's driving style better than Vettel's? Whether this is by design or chance surely is irrelevant its driver performance we're discussing not teams or engineers.

For my part I'd argue that the greatest drivers are always able to either adjust their driving style, or car set up, to cope with inherent design deficiencies and simply drive round the problems to match or stay in front of team mates. This being so I'm inclined to say what I've believed for years, Seb is really a one trick pony, when a car is in the sweet spot for him he can drive it like a rocket ship but when either the car or racing goes against him he invariably makes a dogs dinner of it. Although he's got 4 WDCs they all came when the car truly suited him or was built around him.

Makes me fearful for Aston Martin team next year if the car don't suit the old boy, and even more fearful for Ferrari if they can't build a car that can exploit a 4 times champ's speed how they gonna win again? - Unless of course Charles really is one of the gifted ones, I guess we'll have to wait and see.   

 

   
Racing is Life - everything else is just....waiting. (Steve McQueen)

Offline jimclark

Re: 2020 Eifel Grand Prix - Heroes and Zeroes
« Reply #17 on: October 17, 2020, 03:38:45 AM »
I guess we'll have to wait and see.

That is, as they say, the bottom line;)

And is the suspense that has kept me watching the real racing (:good:) of F1 as opposed to the concocted "shows" of most other pro "racing" of late.  :sick:
Boring to so many, but true competition to determine the very best. I love it.  :'( (<tears of joy btw :D)
"Those were the days my friends. We thought they'd never end..."

jimclark

Offline Alianora La Canta

Re: 2020 Eifel Grand Prix - Heroes and Zeroes
« Reply #18 on: October 26, 2020, 10:28:18 AM »
As stated previously, I don't believe in "punching above a cars weight". There is no BoPing in F1 so every car is in the same "weight" class. The 17 times a Ferrari has finished (of a possible 22) this year, they have been in the points 11 times; in the top 8 eight times. Make what you will of those figures.  :confused:  :D

Only a spec series can have all cars the same weight. F1 is not a spec series, so by definition cars must be different weights.
Percussus resurgio
@lacanta (Twitter)
http://alianoralacanta.tumblr.com (Blog/Tumblr)

Offline cosworth151

Re: 2020 Eifel Grand Prix - Heroes and Zeroes
« Reply #19 on: October 26, 2020, 01:26:11 PM »
"Punching above there weight" is kind of sports slang for over achieving. It refers to boxers who punch as powerfully as boxers in higher weight classes.  :D
“You can search the world over for the finer things, but you won't find a match for the American road and the creatures that live on it.”
― Bob Dylan

Offline jimclark

Re: 2020 Eifel Grand Prix - Heroes and Zeroes
« Reply #20 on: October 27, 2020, 02:42:49 AM »
Only a spec series can have all cars the same weight. F1 is not a spec series, so by definition cars must be different weights.
Negative.
As '151 stated, F1 is an example of a "weight" class in auto racing. F2 would be another "weight" class.
And no, all F1 cars don't have to be different weights. They all must, however, abide by the same minimum weight regulation.

For the life of me I can't remember what year and who it was; but an example of a driver "punching above their weight" was at Nürburgring ('60s iirc, back when F2 was allowed to run with the F1 to expand the field at the 14 mile circuit) when qualifying their F2 car well up amongst the F1 cars. Quite the feat it was...... ;)
« Last Edit: October 27, 2020, 02:52:10 AM by jimclark »
"Those were the days my friends. We thought they'd never end..."

jimclark

Offline Alianora La Canta

Re: 2020 Eifel Grand Prix - Heroes and Zeroes
« Reply #21 on: October 27, 2020, 10:24:46 AM »
"Punching above there weight" is kind of sports slang for over achieving. It refers to boxers who punch as powerfully as boxers in higher weight classes.  :D

Which in F1 is imposed by incoming finances (for constructors) and quality of the car (for drivers).
Percussus resurgio
@lacanta (Twitter)
http://alianoralacanta.tumblr.com (Blog/Tumblr)

 


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