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Author Topic: Stewards Dismiss Review of Hamilton Penalty  (Read 447 times)

Offline cosworth151

Stewards Dismiss Review of Hamilton Penalty
« on: July 30, 2021, 03:11:13 PM »
The stewards have dismissed Red Bull's request to review Lewis Hamilton's Silverstone penalty. After looking at the information RBR presented to them, the stewards deemed it did not qualify as a “significant and relevant new element”.

They added that some of the slides were “not ‘discovered’ but created for the purposes of submissions to support the petition for review. And they were created based on evidence that was available at the time of the decisions. That clearly does not satisfy the requirements of Article 14.”

“The Stewards note, with some concern, certain allegations [which have not been made public] made in the Competitor's above letter. Such allegations may or may not have been relevant to the Stewards if the Petition for Review had been granted. The Stewards may have addressed these allegations directly in any decision that would have followed. The Petition having been dismissed, the Stewards make no comments on those allegations.”

 :yahoo:

https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/article.breaking-stewards-dismiss-red-bull-request-to-review-hamiltons-british-grand.4tB8ExYNrCExZN3QXSPMUP.html



“You can search the world over for the finer things, but you won't find a match for the American road and the creatures that live on it.”
― Bob Dylan

Offline rmassart

Re: Stewards Dismiss Review of Hamilton Penalty
« Reply #1 on: July 30, 2021, 04:02:16 PM »
“The Stewards note, with some concern, certain allegations [which have not been made public] made in the Competitor's above letter...”

I don't quite understand this. Are they having a dig at RB or at Hamilton?

Offline Jericoke

Re: Stewards Dismiss Review of Hamilton Penalty
« Reply #2 on: July 30, 2021, 04:36:35 PM »
"Objection"

"Overruled"

"No, no, no, I strenuously object!"

Offline lkjohnson1950

Re: Stewards Dismiss Review of Hamilton Penalty
« Reply #3 on: July 30, 2021, 05:23:55 PM »
They are saying the R/B may have had a point, but it was mixed in with a lot of irrelevant material and not presented properly, so no go.
Lonny

Offline Alianora La Canta

Re: Stewards Dismiss Review of Hamilton Penalty
« Reply #4 on: July 30, 2021, 06:59:32 PM »
“The Stewards note, with some concern, certain allegations [which have not been made public] made in the Competitor's above letter...”

Deliberately ambiguous, but likely Red Bull. (Edited to add: initially I thought it was ambiguous on the basis of not being allowed to admit reading the documents that deeply, but now I realise that grammatically, the letter being referred to must be Red Bull's. Thus Red Bull is being criticised).

The only possible reason Red Bull could have got a bigger penalty for Lewis is if they had been able to demonstrate that the move was deliberate or unduly reckless (proving which is optional; proving it must have been either is compulsory). Their defence will naturally have reflected this. Either accusation would be reasonably considered an insult to someone of Lewis' racing stature and racing record.

I suspect this was the stewards' way of indicating there is a problem in the wording, given they're not allowed to address the matter directly (given they're only supposed to have done a summary check of the documents).

I don't quite understand this. Are they having a dig at RB or at Hamilton?
[/quote]
« Last Edit: July 30, 2021, 07:02:40 PM by Alianora La Canta »
Percussus resurgio
@lacanta (Twitter)
http://alianoralacanta.tumblr.com (Blog/Tumblr)

Offline Jericoke

Re: Stewards Dismiss Review of Hamilton Penalty
« Reply #5 on: July 31, 2021, 06:02:47 PM »
Apparently the 'new evidence' was a video of Albon driving like Hamilton.

I love Albon, but if he could drive like Hamilton he wouldn't be in DTM this year.

Offline rmassart

Re: Stewards Dismiss Review of Hamilton Penalty
« Reply #6 on: July 31, 2021, 08:54:43 PM »
Just read this on the BBC https://www.bbc.com/sport/formula1/58041542:

Quote
Beyond the question of whether he should have allowed Hamilton more room given the Mercedes had a substantial part of his car alongside the Red Bull on the entry to the corner, there is the matter of Verstappen's entry speed to Copse on the first lap of the race.

This, according to GPS data available to all teams, was 1.5km/h faster with Hamilton on his inside than it had been on his fastest qualifying lap the day before. Copse is taken flat-out in qualifying - but certainly not on the first lap of the race with a full tank of 100kg of fuel, even when a driver is on an ideal line, which Verstappen was not.

Asked about this, Horner said: "I think that would be physically impossible" and "I can't believe [it] to be true based on all the analysis we have looked at prior to the hearing". The data is the data, though.


Maybe the stewards should have taken the new evidence into account and given Verstappen a 10 second penalty for the race in Hungary!

As for Horner, does he still live in the real world or only in his make believe world where Max can do no wrong?

Offline Andy B

Re: Stewards Dismiss Review of Hamilton Penalty
« Reply #7 on: July 31, 2021, 10:24:13 PM »
A comment from an ex driver stated that he had found nobody in the pit lane who agreed with RBR, they seem to be becoming desperate.
Even those who don't like LH have to admit he is a clean racer and there will always be contact at some point find me someone in the current drivers who has never made contact with another car?
Once you have retired every day is a Saturday!

Offline Alianora La Canta

Re: Stewards Dismiss Review of Hamilton Penalty
« Reply #8 on: August 02, 2021, 02:00:31 AM »
Apparently the 'new evidence' was a video of Albon driving like Hamilton.

I love Albon, but if he could drive like Hamilton he wouldn't be in DTM this year.

He certainly can't drive like Hamilton in a two-year-old car from a different team, that doesn't have the same aero philosophy as any car racing this year!

Maybe the stewards should have taken the new evidence into account and given Verstappen a 10 second penalty for the race in Hungary!

As for Horner, does he still live in the real world or only in his make believe world where Max can do no wrong?

The stewards weren't allowed to look at the evidence once they realised it was based on GPS information (which they had at the outset - this isn't Formula E, there's no need to wait for the car to download itself to confirm timing data). Also, kind of hard to give someone a 10-second penalty on a DNF, especially when the rules only allow that to happen if it could be proven Verstappen had had a significant role in the accident - which a one-car simulation aiming to demonstrate Hamilton's affordances would never be able to do.

Note that Red Bull only needed to prove that the line required either deliberation or unusual recklessness, not which of those alternatives it was, to get Hamilton's penalty increased. However, it needed to do one of them, so I'm not surprised there were allegations that neither the stewards nor Mercedes appreciated in there.

(I think Yuki Tsunoda's not crashed into another F1 car yet, only several walls. Give him time).
Percussus resurgio
@lacanta (Twitter)
http://alianoralacanta.tumblr.com (Blog/Tumblr)

Offline monty

Re: Stewards Dismiss Review of Hamilton Penalty
« Reply #9 on: August 02, 2021, 09:09:02 AM »
Quote
I don't quite understand this. Are they having a dig at RB or at Hamilton?
Sky reported it as a dig at RBR. Their interpretation was that the stewards reference of showing 'some concern' regarding 'certain allegations' suggested that RBR were 'fabricating' details and bringing into question the validity of the stewards investigation procedures.
It was also interesting that without making any comment on the images; Sky showed a compilation of 'questionable' overtakes resulting in cars being run off track over recent years and about 60% of the incidents involved Verstappen 'bumping wheels' and forcing other cars off the track (including his team mates!).

 


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