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Author Topic: KERS  (Read 6257 times)

Online Dare

KERS
« on: July 24, 2008, 02:49:31 AM »
simple explanation of the KERS to be
used next year


http://www.popsci.com/cars/article/2008-07/kinetic-energy-formula-one


Mark Twain once opined, "it's easier to con someone than to convince them they've been conned."

Offline cosworth151

Re: KERS
« Reply #1 on: July 24, 2008, 01:27:19 PM »
I guess BMW Sauber are using the electrical version.
“You can search the world over for the finer things, but you won't find a match for the American road and the creatures that live on it.”
― Bob Dylan

Offline Steven Roy

Re: KERS
« Reply #2 on: July 24, 2008, 01:37:49 PM »
So are Red Bull.  It was the batteries over-heating that resulted in their factory being evacuated.

Offline Alianora La Canta

Re: KERS
« Reply #3 on: July 25, 2008, 09:22:20 AM »
Ferrari and Honda have reported no problems so far, by the way.
Percussus resurgio
@lacanta (Twitter)
http://alianoralacanta.tumblr.com (Blog/Tumblr)

TheStig

  • Guest
Re: KERS
« Reply #4 on: September 11, 2008, 10:48:13 PM »
Ferrari is "struggling" with KERS, according to the formula one team's engine chief Gilles Simon. He said the energy recovery technology, due to debut next year, “is a complex subject, which finds us dealing with a lot of new and complicated areas. It will be really challenging to run this system next year. We are learning every day, but we are struggling,” Simon admitted.

Following some other teams' more high profile problems, however, Simon insists that Ferrari is not alone with its concerns about KERS, saying he believes “all teams will struggle to run the new system reliably right from the opening race of the 2009 season”. Ferrari vice president Piero Ferrari was critical of KERS earlier this year, saying it was an area, involving high-capacity batteries and other unfamiliar technology, "unknown to traditional engine men".

http://www.manipef1.com/news/2008/index.php?id=2053&redirect=1

If Ferrari are struggling,What chance for the others?

TheStig

Offline Steven Roy

Re: KERS
« Reply #5 on: September 12, 2008, 08:50:13 PM »
I wonder how much of McLaren's original KERS system is still relevant.  I guess with new batteries, materials and electronics it will be obsolete now

Offline roger44

Re: KERS
« Reply #6 on: January 31, 2009, 12:27:17 PM »
Hi Im new and just looked in on this discussion. What I dont understand is how do they intend to get the powerfrom the batteries into the drive train to make the car go faster then the interna engine which is driving it.
Its the sheer mechanics of the output I want to know about. I understand where they get the volts from, but how do they output it.
Does anybody know?

Offline Neil.P

Re: KERS
« Reply #7 on: January 31, 2009, 02:14:12 PM »
Hiya Roger, welcome along. Hope you enjoy it here.

Neil.P

Offline cosworth151

Re: KERS
« Reply #8 on: January 31, 2009, 05:07:33 PM »
Howdy, Roger. Glad to have you here!

A d.c. electric motor and generator are essentially the same thing. The main difference is in the wiring. Under braking, the unit would convert the kinetic energy of the car into electricity, which would be stored in the batteries. Normally, the brakes would convert this energy to heat. When the KERS unit was triggered, it would go into Motor mode and feed power to the transaxle.

A similar system has been used in trams & electric railways for decades, with the generated electric fed back into the power line. It's called Regenerative Braking.

Hope this helps.

Cos
“You can search the world over for the finer things, but you won't find a match for the American road and the creatures that live on it.”
― Bob Dylan

Offline roger44

Re: KERS
« Reply #9 on: January 31, 2009, 05:25:14 PM »
Thanks for info, but how does it feed power to the transaxle, is it a direct coupling, or clutched.
Does it over rev the engine, which must be rev limited to 18k this year.
the load must suddenly come of the crank and then back on 6 seconds later. Masive transmission shocks.
See what I mean? it always raises more questions than answers.

Offline cosworth151

Re: KERS
« Reply #10 on: January 31, 2009, 05:45:58 PM »
I think most of the systems are using magnetic clutches, but I'm not sure. The system would most likely be used during acceleration, when the engines are below top rpm's. As for the shock to the gearboxes, that should be interesting!

Here's a link that has a good diagram of the mechanical connection:

http://www.themotorreport.com.au/6274/f1-kers-off-to-a-shakey-start/

There is also a KERS unit that stores the energy mechanically in a flywheel. Williams is using such a system.

I worked on a project to develop a similar system back in grad school. (late '70s/early '80s) It was tested on commuter trains, but never went past the test phase.

http://www.racecar-engineering.com/news/people/254890/williams-f1-hybrid-kers.html
“You can search the world over for the finer things, but you won't find a match for the American road and the creatures that live on it.”
― Bob Dylan

Offline John S

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Re: KERS
« Reply #11 on: January 31, 2009, 06:59:20 PM »
Ferrari is "struggling" with KERS, according to the formula one team's engine chief Gilles Simon. He said the energy recovery technology, due to debut next year, “is a complex subject, which finds us dealing with a lot of new and complicated areas. It will be really challenging to run this system next year. We are learning every day, but we are struggling,” Simon admitted.



If Ferrari are struggling,What chance for the others?

TheStig

Hiya Roger good to have you with us.

Ferrari are more upbeat about KERS since the turn of the year, see this report from Autosport that I posted earlier in the month.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/72941
Racing is Life - everything else is just....waiting. (Steve McQueen)

Offline Alianora La Canta

Re: KERS
« Reply #12 on: January 31, 2009, 10:56:02 PM »
Welcome to GPWizard, roger44. Hope you enjoy yourself here :)
Percussus resurgio
@lacanta (Twitter)
http://alianoralacanta.tumblr.com (Blog/Tumblr)

Offline Steven Roy

Re: KERS
« Reply #13 on: February 01, 2009, 05:05:25 PM »
Hi Roger.  Always good to have another member on board.

The interesting thing about Ferrari's comments about how far behind they are on KERS is that they are using a Magnetti Marelli system which Renault and both Red Bull teams are using and none of them are complaining about timescale.

Online Dare

Re: KERS
« Reply #14 on: February 01, 2009, 06:49:00 PM »
Ferrari probably has the advanced Magnetti
Marelli KERS while the others have customer
car KERS
Mark Twain once opined, "it's easier to con someone than to convince them they've been conned."

 


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