GPWizard F1 Forum
F1 News & Discussions => General F1 Discussion => Topic started by: Monty on November 19, 2012, 12:21:27 PM
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Sorry if someone has already started this somewhere else but I just wanted to sing the praises of some of the drivers at Austin (oh and have a rant about Schumacher).
It was a great race and my man Button drove a great race from a difficult starting position.
Biggest praise goes to Jenson and Kimi - that is how professional racing drivers deal with overtaking!!
Praise also to Hamilton and Vettel for keeping some excitement at the front (although Vettel really let himself down with the pathetic whinging about Hamilton overtaking - Vettel should think himself lucky that his last minute weaving didn't cause a horrific crash).
Also a nod to Hulk, Maldanado and Senna for some mid-pack fights.
As for Schumacher....... thank goodness he is going. What did he think he could achieve (other than risking killing someone) by pushing much faster cars almost off the track when they were overtaking him. The man is a danger to everyone on the track!
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Heroes:
I give the biggest thumbs up to Hamilton. He had to keep a .3 gap for the last 10 laps, and he managed to quite well. Not a fan of his, but I hope he enjoys what could well be his last F1 trophy.
Alonso and Kimi. Tough old farts who just never give up. Soooo glad Vettel finished 2nd. Brasil and rain could equal an Alonso championship.
Too bad Buttons KERS died at the end. Glad it didn't lead to an end like Webber.
Maldonado, Senna, Hulk and Grossjean all deserve driving merit badges, even if all had small mistakes early on (Grossjean's was rather large).
Massa - I didn't know about the gearbox seal. I didn't hear the why in my coverage. Well, hopefully he is not surprised and will just settle in for his swan song ride at Ferrari and retire at the end of next year. Great drive for I think the third time this year (that I've mentioned him as a hero).
Zeroes:
RBR - why does Webber's car break so much more often than Vettel's?
Vettel - cry me a river you spoiled brat. Hamilton does the best pass he can manage with Vettel trying to slam into him, and Vettel complains??? How embarrassing it must be. Vettel seems like such a likeable guy in interviews, but then acts like such a weasel on the track and the radio.
Schumacher - kamikaze defence. Lucky he didn't take anyone out. I like him, I feel sorry for him that things haven't worked out at Mercedes. What really surprises me is that someone like Hamilton may actually think he can possibly do more with the Merc than Michael. I don't see that happening. Hopefully Ross Brawn had started working on the new Merc, oh I don't know, maybe by the time the European season started, and abandoned any development of this car, because it just stinks, and I doubt anyone can do anything about it.
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Heroes, already all been said.
Zero...Tilke's huge high speed run-offs, apart from those I liked the circuit.
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Vettel - cry me a river you spoiled brat. Hamilton does the best pass he can manage with Vettel trying to slam into him, and Vettel complains??? How embarrassing it must be. Vettel seems like such a likeable guy in interviews, but then acts like such a weasel on the track and the radio.
Vettel wasn't whining about Hamilton's move, he was whining about being held up a few turns before (by Karthikeyan I think) that allowed Hamilton to catch up. I'm not saying he wasn't whining, just clarifying. This was correctly picked up at the time by Coulthard on BBC but not by the Sky commentators, who assumed like the rest of us that he was whining about Hamilton's move.
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I had a Sky feed for this race. Commentary is really second class compared to BBC in my opinion. Thanks for clarifying Vintly, but most of the time I still think Vettel is a spoiled brat. He moans almost every time he doesn't win. And I wonder if Hamilton complained about Vettel's zig zag in the DRS zone.
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Yep, his flashes of petulance do him no favours. With any luck he'll win in Brazil from the front so we won't have to hear any more of it for a while. ;)
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Yep, his flashes of petulance do him no favours. With any luck he'll win in Brazil from the front so we won't have to hear any more of it for a while. ;)
We'd just have to put up with his finger and 'yes baby' remarks which are just as bad :(.
My hero of the race was Narain Karthikeyan, while my zeroes were Schumacher and the whole Mercedes team collectively for a thoroughly lousy race performance, and the fact that the circuit designers failed regarding the gravel traps again.
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As for Schumacher....... thank goodness he is going. What did he think he could achieve (other than risking killing someone) by pushing much faster cars almost off the track when they were overtaking him. The man is a danger to everyone on the track!
I have always been an MS fan, well from his Ferrari days anyway. However I have to agree he was playing silly buggers with his stupid tactics at the US GP. Hate to say it but I'm glad he's off too, before he wrecks my opinion of him totally.
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What gets me is if Mercedes finally get a good car next year or the
year after Hamilton and his fans will think he's responsible for the
Mercedes turn around.
If the car is much improved I hope Rosberg smokes his drawers
and I'm not a big Nico fan either
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Vettel is a sore loser, and who is not. And he said all those words in a pit radio, so cannot they be given a little freedom regarding their communication with pit crew. They will show disappointments, illogical argument, their despise and frustration..
Just because he was a cry baby with his crew, does not make himself a zero. This guy really pushed the race to the limit. Ok if not a hero, but zero? People I understand your frustration with this guy for making races mundane and boring, but he got to do what he does best..
Regarding Schumi, well he has a reputation for being the tough one to pass, so he was just being himself.. ;)
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Heroes: Massa. He was faster than Nando in every Q session and then was once again slapped down. He responded by pulling himself up to 4th only 6 seconds Back of Ferd.
Hamilton. He dealt with Webber then kept the pressure on Vettel until he got a break in traffic then made a great pass and controlled the gap to the finish.
Button, Ricciardo both had excellent races, too bad Daniel didn't make the points.
Zeroes: None really. A great race up and down the field.
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Just because he was a cry baby with his crew, does not make himself a zero.
Heroes and Zeroes is more a place where we can voice our opinions on how a driver added to or subtracted, to or from a race. It's not just about track performance, but how that person (or sometimes team - and don't forget Tilke or Bernie is often mentioned) affected that particular race for each of us.
When I had the mistaken impression (thanks Sky) that Vettel was complaining about a perfectly legitimate pass by Hamilton, it spoiled it for me with Vettel. I was happy to see him passed, and I grant he did a good race to that point (and kept Hamilton honest to the end), but his comments turned him to a zero for me.
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Dear Scott, you are being a tad little harsh with our young German here..I mean for the sake of heaven Scott, judged only because of what he felt being passed? And that is also not in media, not in a press conference, but over the radio..
I am not sure about Narain involvement, but given the history between these two, he may be facing a reprimand for sure, if not any grid penalty.
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No no, you should look back to when Schumacher was dominating. Just cause he won a race, didn't make him a hero of some people ;). I feel the same way about Vettel. Just because he is driving the fastest car with possibly the best design team in F1, and arguably the second best funded team in F1, does not give him the RIGHT to win a race, nor be a 'hero' in my eyes.
But back on topic, I'll scratch him from my zero list because I mistakenly thought the comment referred to the pass by Hamilton. Still won't get a hero mention though. He's still a whiner though, even the team's response about how he should pay attention to the things at hand indicate they know this behavior by him.
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I am not sure about Narain involvement, but given the history between these two, he may be facing a reprimand for sure, if not any grid penalty.
If Karthikeyan is penalised for that, then it would be a disgrace. He didn't deliberately hold Vettel up, he didn't exceed the blue flag/marshal post limits, Vettel just caught him at the worst possible point on the track. Had Hamilton not been following so closely behind, it wouldn't even have been a talking point.
If we're going to start going down the road of penalising back markers for not driving off the track every time the leaders come up behind them, then it's getting silly. I mean, today's drivers really have nothing to complain about when compared to the sorts of things that Arnoux got up to at the tail end of his career when driving for Ligier (Monaco 1989 springs to mind).
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Which brings me back to my old argument, get rid of the blue flags, if a driver/s in the fastest cars can't get past a backmarker without the aid of a blue flag they're not entitled to be called WDC's.
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Heroes:
Hamilton - A fine drive in a come-from-behind situation.
Massa - Pretty much out drove Alonso all week-end. Might have had a shot at the race if his team hadn't back stabbed him.
Zeroes:
Schumacher - The Schumacher Chop carried to the extreme. I hoped he would do well in his come-back. Now, I'm glad he's going.
Ferrari - A cheap trick that may have cost them the race.
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Vettel wasn't whining about Hamilton's move, he was whining about being held up a few turns before (by Karthikeyan I think) that allowed Hamilton to catch up. I'm not saying he wasn't whining, just clarifying. This was correctly picked up at the time by Coulthard on BBC but not by the Sky commentators, who assumed like the rest of us that he was whining about Hamilton's move.
Sad sole that I am, I watched Sky live and then watched the BBC coverage. Ant and Coulthard suggested that Vettel was refering to Karthikeyan but all the other pundits disagreed. If you listen to what he actually said it certainly sounds like a whine about Hamilton's overtake and the actual radio transmission was just after Hamilton overtook (quite a few seconds after Vettel had caught Karthikeyan). Whatever he was refering to, perhaps rather than whining he should have been concentrating on racing!
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Vettel wasn't whining about Hamilton's move, he was whining about being held up a few turns before (by Karthikeyan I think) that allowed Hamilton to catch up. I'm not saying he wasn't whining, just clarifying. This was correctly picked up at the time by Coulthard on BBC but not by the Sky commentators, who assumed like the rest of us that he was whining about Hamilton's move.
Sad sole that I am, I watched Sky live and then watched the BBC coverage. Ant and Coulthard suggested that Vettel was refering to Karthikeyan but all the other pundits disagreed. If you listen to what he actually said it certainly sounds like a whine about Hamilton's overtake and the actual radio transmission was just after Hamilton overtook (quite a few seconds after Vettel had caught Karthikeyan). Whatever he was refering to, perhaps rather than whining he should have been concentrating on racing!
You're not sad in my book – I saw the Sky then BBC coverage too. I even watched some of the Sky programme again to get 5 onboard laps with Jenson on his way to overtaking Raikkonen. Absolutely brilliant – with no commentary and just the sound of the car it's fantastic, watching him gradually tee-up the pass. Anyway, I digress...
The radio transmissions aren't live, they're delayed for a while, so it certainly looked like his comments were about Hamilton, but we'll have to agree to disagree on whether they were or not. This article sheds some light on it:
http://en.espnf1.com/usa/motorsport/story/95405.html (http://en.espnf1.com/usa/motorsport/story/95405.html)
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Going by past Vettel remarks I'm going with
it was about Hamilton's pass
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Going by past Vettel remarks I'm going with
it was about Hamilton's pass
:DD :DD :good:
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Heroes:-
Jenson, what a recovery drive from way down in 15th at one point, and no help from safety cars - unlike precious Vettel in Abu Dhabi.
Hamilton for keeping the pressure on Aussie Mark & the Spoiled kid in clearly the best cars, and for taking the chances that fell to him to get by the Bulls.
Ferrari team for making the right calls both on grid slots and then Felippe's pit stop. Both things gained the drivers places.
Special mention for 'The Hulk' kept both Williams at bay for a considerable part of the race, if they had got by and opened a gap he could never have recovered it, so
good 'Trulli train' tactics. :D
Zeros:-
Renault and their damned alternaters, por old Mark. Still it means the chase is closer going to Brazil so not all bad. ;)
Vettel - He can reel off fastest laps when he wants, but he failed to make the break in the important stage of the race, namely the second half. He and Red Bull can mutter all they like about Nahrain in the HRT, but Seb allowing Lewis to close the gap after the pit stops is the real reason the overtake was possible. The fast lap was way too late, stupid boy!
Grosjean - Once again he showed he's not up to driving a top car with the big boys, without the generous run-offs, another zero by the way, his race would have been over. Let's hope the real brains at Enstone keep his name off a contract for next year.
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I totally agree with you Irisado, but when Narain was penalized in Malaysia, apperently for no reason at all, I have fear of having the same thing happening again.
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The radio transmissions aren't live, they're delayed for a while, so it certainly looked like his comments were about Hamilton, but we'll have to agree to disagree on whether they were or not. This article sheds some light on it:
I wasn't talking about the transmitted radio call I was talking about the actual radio call. It was timed immediately after Hamilton overtook.
I accept the comments could still have been caused by the frustration of getting held up behind Karthikeyan but it is clear that Vettel was commenting about Hamilton.
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I think making Vettel a zero is a bit harsh, and that is based on pit radio. What if the radio message was not played during the race. Would you have same opinion as now?
After all they are not angels, they are humans, and they are allowed to have flaws. I tends to judge them on the basis of racing, and their ability to race cars right at the edge.
Obviously everybody has their own way of judgement... ;)
But for this track only I will agree with Monty, Micheal was way too dangerous..
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In light of Mark's car giving out, I wonder if Vettel was being told to protect his machine. A 2nd to Hamilton wasn't the best outcome for him, but a DNF would have been disastrous.
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Which brings me back to my old argument, get rid of the blue flags, if a driver/s in the fastest cars can't get past a backmarker without the aid of a blue flag they're not entitled to be called WDC's.
You'd hear no complaints from me if they were to do that, especially not now that they have DRS assistance.
I totally agree with you Irisado, but when Narain was penalized in Malaysia, apperently for no reason at all, I have fear of having the same thing happening again.
Yes, that was a terrible decision by the FIA stewards, and I share your fears about unreasonable penalties for drivers at the back of the grid.
Also, if Vettel really thinks, as he suggested back in Malaysia, that Karthikeyan is a bad F1 driver, he's lucky he didn't drive in the 1990s, when there were some truly bad drivers on the grid.
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Yes, that was a terrible decision by the FIA stewards, and I share your fears about unreasonable penalties for drivers at the back of the grid.
Also, if Vettel really thinks, as he suggested back in Malaysia, that Karthikeyan is a bad F1 driver, he's lucky he didn't drive in the 1990s, when there were some truly bad drivers on the grid.
Now wouldn't it be good if the top 6 in each years championship had to attend a test session, after season end, to drive the bottom 6 cars. :D
I'd definitely pay to watch, especially with car to pit radio feed. ;)
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I for one give the small crews a lot of credit.To not have
the best funds,engineers,or crews and only be 1 second
a lap slower ain't bad in my books.Compared to other
series these are extremely fast cars
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I for one give the small crews a lot of credit.To not have
the best funds,engineers,or crews and only be 1 second
a lap slower ain't bad in my books.Compared to other
series these are extremely fast cars
Totally agree with you Dare, these are the teams lives for racing, hardly makes the glamorous side unlike the big teams, yet they put their heart out, and make sure that the spirit of racing is still alive.
For me Sauber is the best possible example, not the well funded team, but they are the most significant team to derive great number of feats along this year..