GPWizard F1 Forum
F1 News & Discussions => General F1 Discussion => Topic started by: Monty on November 04, 2013, 01:24:31 PM
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I didn't even bother watching the race live - just waited for the BBC highlights and even 'fast-forwarded' a few times through them!
The tyres made of chocolate have completely ruined F1.
There is no racing left .... "we suggest you hold a two second gap behind 'x' to save your tyres"; "you are pushing too hard the front right is turning into a fondent"; "oh good overtaking now please pit because your tres have melted".
Touring cars (particularly BTCC), MotoGP, World SuperBikes, British SuperBikes, etc., etc. all provide fantastic racing but F1 only brings 'strategy'. I can only hope that the new regs next year bring back some hard charging track action or I really think I will give up watching (I'm sure that will worry Bernie!).
On a positive note - well done to Paul DiResta for melting his tyres a little bit less than some of the others and bringing home some well deserved points.
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It's an open secret that drivers hate these tyres, and can't race to their capabilities or the capabilities of the cars. Not a good situation, and in danger of becoming dull - this race was certainly in that category.
I even found myself saying on chat 'Oh I love it when it gets dark and the lights reflect off the cars.' Sad! It's a pathetic reflection (pardon the pun) on the lack of on-track action.
I'd be happier if there were a few smashes - there's hardly any these days! Boring! The odd puncture is about all we get...
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Totally and utterly agree with you Monty, yup, BTCC is better than WTCC.
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I'm in two minds about branding the race boring, sure Vettel did the usual run and hide trick but there was quite a few good battles up and down the grid., and I enjoyed a lot of them.
The trouble with tyres that are too durable is a more fixed outcome to races. With reliability being so high and the areo being so sophisticated we would not only see almost no overtaking we could also get very processional racing, drivers all finishing pretty much in their qualy positions.
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I dnf and that was Kimi's fault.We used to pick 5
or higher in the GG dnf's and hope that was enough.
10 years ago I would tape the practices and rewatch
them,now I pass on them and hope for a non Vettel win.
Bring the excitement back,please
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You guys who say the tires make the racing boring are forgetting 5+ years ago when the tires would last a full race stint and there would be virtually no passing after turn 1 for the whole race. The high wear tires at least introduce a little uncertainty in the proceedings. The only "cure" for F1 would be a huge change in the aero rules, either reduce the downforce by a large amount, or allow some form of ground effects so the cars are less dependent on the front wings for steering. Neither will happen because the teams don't want it.
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Another F1 Reg not well thought out. The whole point of the tires going off was to ensure the teams would need to change more often, but the FIA didn't consider how the teams would manage them so conservatively.
I'm with Lonny, it's the aero that needs to change.
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it's the aero that needs to change
I understand but do not fully agree. We now have DRS and KERS to help overtaking but trying to get into an overtaking position kills the tyres. I know this starts a whole new argument about DRS being 'artificial' (which it is) but we have not seen the really good racers like Alonso, Hamilton, Kimi, etc. being able to wring the neck of the car because when they try, their tyres melt!
If I ruled the regs the racing would be epic (obviously) but at the moment I do not think there is any argument that what F1 currently offers is 'Racing'. It is car set-up, compromise and strategy but not racing and it is completely boring.
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The tire management gave us about the only non-boring parts of the race. If the tires were as dependable as the other parts of a modern F1 car, the entire finish would have been decided by Lap 1, Turn 4.
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Overtaking figures haven't changed over the last three years - they're still consistently in the 50s per race - this is GOOD THING, compared to the Schumacher years.
I agree there's a boring element creeping in, but I don't think it's as bad as it's made out. If you removed Vettel from the last 7 races, you'd find each race was exciting, plenty of overtakes, a changing podium from race to race including both Ferrari drivers, both Lotus drivers, both Mercedes drivers plus The Hulk and Webber.
For me the boring element isn't aero, or tyres – even though they're too weak. It's the circuits. I don't think reliability can be counted as a valid reason, because it's another GOOD THING that the cars are reliable. This is probably a minority view, but I think racing's spoiled when a car malfunctions. If the driver's knackered the car through thrashing it, that's a different thing - I digress.
Point is, if circuits were more dangerous, there'd be more exciting racing. More danger is exciting in itself, not counting the added crashes, dangerous moves, breathtaking courage etc needed on dangerous tracks. More safety cars, anxious moments when we wait to hear about a potential injury. Also the drivers are becoming boring, PR mouthpiece dullards a lot of them. This is a scourge of the modern age, where we place too much emphasis on safety. Racing should be risky.
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You guys who say the tires make the racing boring are forgetting 5+ years ago when the tires would last a full race stint and there would be virtually no passing after turn 1 for the whole race. The high wear tires at least introduce a little uncertainty in the proceedings. The only "cure" for F1 would be a huge change in the aero rules, either reduce the downforce by a large amount, or allow some form of ground effects so the cars are less dependent on the front wings for steering. Neither will happen because the teams don't want it.
There's less passing that sticks now (as opposed to passes that only last for 1-2 DRS zones) than there was 5 years ago. Most of what goes on now provides the illusion of passing without any of the benefits. (And when it doesn't, it's usually because a driver's left their tyres on so long that the likes of me and Dad have been shouting at the screen for them to pit for about 3 laps beforehand).
Short of the powers-that-be having a brainwave on how to improve the downforce:mechanical grip ratio, the best thing they can do for meaningful overtaking is to restore the pre-2011 rules (preferably the 2010 ruleset, which had lots of overtaking) and maybe allow KERS as an automatic acceleration boost instead of its current function of push-to-defend function (in the 2010 ruleset it was informally banned).
The FIA won't allow ground effect as it contradicts their views on safety.
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Yes, it was absolutely boring, but I don't blame the tyres for this. In fact, tyre degradation is the only thing that spices up the racing. The cars never break down any more, DRS passes are artificial, and usually too easy, and when drivers make mistakes they sail across acres of tarmac and rejoin without any damage to their cars. As a spectacle it's just dull.
I fully agree with those who are arguing for something to be done about the aerodynamics. Even when the tyres were more durable, drivers would have to back off, because running in the dirty air was causing the car to understeer, which had a negative effect on the tyres. The aero in Formula 1 is way too dominant, and they have to do something about it.
They really need to do something about the circuits as well. The ridiculous debates about exceeding track limits, and having to send overtaking manoeuvres up to the stewards room would all be avoided if they put gravel traps back in. There was none of this exceeding the track limits prior to the new generation of bland car park tracks being introduced, because if a driver did exceed the track limits, they lost time through dipping a wheel into the gravel, or over the grass.
As for reliability, you all know where I stand on that. Stop forcing the teams to make the cars bullet proof, and just pay them more to cover the costs.
The BTCC offers a far superior spectacle compared to F1 most of the time.