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F1 News & Discussions => General F1 Discussion => Topic started by: Calman on March 31, 2018, 09:40:35 PM

Title: Kubica Deliberately Sabotaging Williams!!
Post by: Calman on March 31, 2018, 09:40:35 PM
Hi folks!

I have heard some garbage from Villeneuve over the years, but this latest opinion is well up the list!!
http://autoweek.com/article/formula-one/robert-kubica-deliberately-sabotaging-williams-f1-team

I think it is Jacques who needs the paper bag over his head!!!!

All the best,
Cal :)
Title: Re: Kubica Deliberately Sabotaging Williams!!
Post by: Alianora La Canta on March 31, 2018, 10:08:53 PM
What is it with Williams and picking up sabotage accusations? Surely they'd be the last team in the paddock to consider such an ignoble act? (Pastor Maldonado accused them of the same thing near the end of 2013, and last I checked Robert wasn't at Williams back then...)
Title: Re: Kubica Deliberately Sabotaging Williams!!
Post by: guest3164 on March 31, 2018, 10:29:34 PM
I'm pretty certain I saw Kubica running from the Williams garage with a box of matches at Barcelona in 2012 too.  He's always had it in for the team.   :tease:
Title: Re: Kubica Deliberately Sabotaging Williams!!
Post by: Jericoke on April 01, 2018, 05:06:34 PM
I will unabashedly support JV.  Once again, we have F1 writers creating a mountain out of a molehill.

Villeneuve accuses Kubica of developing the car to suit his driving style.  Well gee, what else is he supposed to do?  I wouldn't expect a 'mere' development driver to have the skills to replicate the driving styles of a 'better' F1 driver.  If Kubica could drive just like Stroll or Sirotkin then he'd be the #1 driver.

Now, of course JV throws in that Kubica is doing it on purpose, because he would.  Not an ideal sentiment, but a common one amongst F1 drivers.  I'd love to see drivers elevate against that.  Alas, drivers with the skill and humility are few and far between.  (Just as rare as arrogant Canadians!)
Title: Re: Kubica Deliberately Sabotaging Williams!!
Post by: Calman on April 01, 2018, 06:37:06 PM
I will unabashedly support JV.  Once again, we have F1 writers creating a mountain out of a molehill.

Fair comment to a point, but I have observed several of JV's live interviews over the years ... where he often lets a pile of nonsense fall out of his mouth.

I guess all those rare arrogant Canadians have congregated in my city, lucky me!!!  :DD

All the best,
Cal :)
Title: Re: Kubica Deliberately Sabotaging Williams!!
Post by: Scott on April 01, 2018, 08:29:29 PM
As another unbiased Canadian, I declare that I like JV less than any other WDC in F1 that I know of. 

Loved him in Indy, but only when his mouth was closed.

 8) 8)  Sorry Jeri
Title: Re: Kubica Deliberately Sabotaging Williams!!
Post by: Dare on April 01, 2018, 10:25:06 PM
As another unbiased Canadian, I declare that I like JV less than any other WDC in F1 that I know of. 

Loved him in Indy, but only when his mouth was closed.

 8) 8)  Sorry Jeri

As a unbiased Yank I liked JV in Indy too,especially when he
won the 500 as a rookie{I think}. I remember him then as a
nice kid....what happened
Title: Re: Kubica Deliberately Sabotaging Williams!!
Post by: Calman on April 06, 2018, 01:28:24 AM
.. on the theme of JV!

Lance returns the compliment:
https://www.racefans.net/2018/04/06/racefans-round-up-06-04/

Nothing like shooting down your own countryman eh?

All the best,
Cal :)
Title: Re: Kubica Deliberately Sabotaging Williams!!
Post by: Jericoke on April 06, 2018, 03:15:22 PM
.. on the theme of JV!

Lance returns the compliment:
https://www.racefans.net/2018/04/06/racefans-round-up-06-04/

Nothing like shooting down your own countryman eh?

All the best,
Cal :)

The greatest loss in Canadian MotorSports history (with all due respect to would have been WDC Gilles Villeneuve) was Greg Moore.  He was the exact best guy to represent Canada at the F1 level (and I have no doubt he would have).  He had the skill to be there and humility to draw other Canadians into competitive racing. 

Jacques certainly belonged in F1 on skill alone.  His name helped for sure, so it's not a path other Canadians can take.  Stroll is definitely worthy of F1, but it's hard to say he's there on skill alone.  Canadian kids can't really look to Stroll and say they can be just like him to get into F1.

I hope that Stroll finds success and does inspire more Canadians. 

I wish that Villeneuve would be more 'Canadian' in the way he speaks out, but he's hardly going to change now.
Title: Re: Kubica Deliberately Sabotaging Williams!!
Post by: Dare on April 06, 2018, 03:25:16 PM
Stroll's billionaire dad couldn't have any reason with
him being in F1 could it :DntKnw:
Title: Re: Kubica Deliberately Sabotaging Williams!!
Post by: Jericoke on April 06, 2018, 07:58:37 PM
Stroll's billionaire dad couldn't have any reason with
him being in F1 could it :DntKnw:

Most of the "pay drivers" in F1 are good enough these days. They may not be in the top 20 drivers, but top 40 drivers for sure, and there's probably very little difference from 10 downto 50.

Of course, 'coming up' would be where having a billionaire dad helps.  Having the best Kart with freshly tuned engines and sticker tires every race would have given Stroll plenty of opportunity that others don't have.  Those opportunities turn into experience, which turns into skill.  I can't blame Stroll for taking advantage of what he had, I know I would.  Even with every advantage, he still had to put in the time and effort.  It just doesn't make him aspirational.
Title: Re: Kubica Deliberately Sabotaging Williams!!
Post by: Scott on April 07, 2018, 09:00:49 AM
I don’t hold anyone’s heritage against them.  Which family/country you are born into is nothing but luck.  It’s how you behave that defines you as a person.  JV behaves like a spoiled brat, while Lance doesn’t.  JV didn’t come from “nowhere” either, so he wasn’t very aspirational, but his Dad did and was.
Title: Re: Kubica Deliberately Sabotaging Williams!!
Post by: guest3164 on April 07, 2018, 10:34:55 AM
Lance Stroll does seem to have matured, he is far from a spoilt brat.  At first I thought he might be, but to be fair to him, he does not come across badly in a sport of huge egos.  I want him to do well, I would really love it as a fan of Williams if he can show some stunning pace. 

Villeneuve I think just has to spout rubbish as it is all that will prevent him becoming irrelevant now.  A pity though, I ought to hold him in a much higher regard as the last Williams world champion.
Title: Re: Kubica Deliberately Sabotaging Williams!!
Post by: cosworth151 on April 07, 2018, 06:18:24 PM
I agree with Jeri about Greg Moore. I believe that F1 would have been in his future, too. He was a great loss to racing.
Title: Re: Kubica Deliberately Sabotaging Williams!!
Post by: guest3164 on April 07, 2018, 08:18:52 PM
I actually now think Paddy Lowe is sabotaging Williams  :tease:
Title: Re: Kubica Deliberately Sabotaging Williams!!
Post by: Dare on April 07, 2018, 10:34:02 PM
I don't think Williams needs any help sabotaging their cars. Bet
Kubica gets a race soon
Title: Re: Kubica Deliberately Sabotaging Williams!!
Post by: Calman on April 08, 2018, 01:38:43 AM
Dark days for Williams!!

Clearly there will be mixed opinion on whether Sergey proves a good signing at Williams this season and Lance's comments on how he performed, compared with Felipe last season, well, they could be thrown out of the window, should Sergey start to get the upper hand on Saturday qualifying!! (so the comparison towards Lance's "more experienced teammate" will become a less justified excuse).

As we can now see, the obvious problem is "the car" ... and seeing Williams at the very back of the grid, without any on track drama or obvious mechanical issues, well, this is starting to look worse than McLaren's woes a season or two ago!!

So basically, the Williams is underperforming on slow corners, fast corners .. and straights (didn't we hear a similar observation towards another team in the recent past??).

All the best,
Cal :)

Title: Re: Kubica Deliberately Sabotaging Williams!!
Post by: Alianora La Canta on April 09, 2018, 05:58:13 PM
The car is so bad that any judgement on the drivers' capabilities is moot - I think both drivers are capable of more than the car is able to show right now.

I'll stop there because I'm not sure "my" team's car is all that much better at the moment...
Title: Re: Kubica Deliberately Sabotaging Williams!!
Post by: guest3164 on April 09, 2018, 08:27:13 PM
The car is so bad that any judgement on the drivers' capabilities is moot - I think both drivers are capable of more than the car is able to show right now.

I'll stop there because I'm not sure "my" team's car is all that much better at the moment...

Well, the main thing for you is that it 'is' better, even if not at the level of last year's car.  The decline of 'my' team is astonishing in the rapidity of it.  I hope that something can be done to sort out the issues but at the moment the car looks destined to remain rooted to the final places for the foreseeable future.  I wish the car gave both drivers a better chance to show their abilities as I feel both are capable of driving fast. 
Title: Re: Kubica Deliberately Sabotaging Williams!!
Post by: Dare on April 09, 2018, 09:40:09 PM
Wonder how much longer William's will remain in F1 with
these kind of results? It has to be embarrassing as hell for
a team that used to be among the best
Title: Re: Kubica Deliberately Sabotaging Williams!!
Post by: Calman on April 10, 2018, 01:37:24 AM
Wonder how much longer William's will remain in F1 with
these kind of results? It has to be embarrassing as hell for
a team that used to be among the best

It's far from ideal isn't it Dare!

To think, McLaren were the laughing stock 24-48 months ago.  Williams may have to endure similar pain, just to reach mid pack on a regular basis!!

You can help but wonder (if you watched Sky coverage) ... another little segment of Kubica slotted into the build up to the race.  We all see how bad the car is, but Robert's promotion seems to be strengthening and you would have to believe that if either Stroll/Sirotkin's results get any worse (can they??) ... well, let's see how things end up by "summer break".

Right now, Williams may as well put Ant & Dec "talent" in the car, as the car is where 99% of the issues are.

All the best,
Cal :)
Title: Re: Kubica Deliberately Sabotaging Williams!!
Post by: Jericoke on April 10, 2018, 03:50:22 AM
Wonder how much longer William's will remain in F1 with
these kind of results? It has to be embarrassing as hell for
a team that used to be among the best

Like Ferrari and McLaren, Williams' F1 team is part of a larger organization, and that larger organization makes plenty of money, because of the name brand recognition of their F1 team.  That's why Mercedes and Red Bull can spend so much money, it's not about winning, it's about advertising.

Williams can't outspend Mercedes and Red Bull, but they don't have to.
Title: Re: Kubica Deliberately Sabotaging Williams!!
Post by: Dare on April 10, 2018, 04:55:30 AM
Wonder how much longer William's will remain in F1 with
these kind of results? It has to be embarrassing as hell for
a team that used to be among the best

It's far from ideal isn't it Dare!

To think, McLaren were the laughing stock 24-48 months ago.  Williams may have to endure similar pain, just to reach mid pack on a regular basis!!

You can help but wonder (if you watched Sky coverage) ... another little segment of Kubica slotted into the build up to the race.  We all see how bad the car is, but Robert's promotion seems to be strengthening and you would have to believe that if either Stroll/Sirotkin's results get any worse (can they??) ... well, let's see how things end up by "summer break".

Right now, Williams may as well put Ant & Dec "talent" in the car, as the car is where 99% of the issues are.

All the best,
Cal :)


After seeing how much of a dog this car is do you think Kubica
wants the drive? Reminds me of when Michael was wanting to return
to F1 and he saw how bad the Ferrari was. Fisichella left Force India
when they finally had a decent car to fulfill his dream of driving for Ferrari.
Title: Re: Kubica Deliberately Sabotaging Williams!!
Post by: Calman on April 10, 2018, 05:54:15 AM
After seeing how much of a dog this car is do you think Kubica
wants the drive?

For a traditional situation up & down the grid, an average to good driver looking to hook up with an average to good team, well, your comment is 100% correct.    However, as we can all clearly see how poorly Williams developed their 2018 car and we know that Kubica would probably outshine both of the current Williams drivers, I am fairly sure Robert would relish the opportunity, simply to show he is still capable of running competitively with 19 other petrol heads (again, making allowances for the lack of pace from the equipment underneath him).

All the best,
Cal :)
Title: Re: Kubica Deliberately Sabotaging Williams!!
Post by: lkjohnson1950 on April 10, 2018, 06:01:20 AM
Perhaps some of the problem is having two drivers who are not well versed in the development of an F1 car?
Title: Re: Kubica Deliberately Sabotaging Williams!!
Post by: guest3164 on April 10, 2018, 09:08:55 AM
By Kubica's own words, there is not a great deal more the drivers can do.  He believes that the solution is simple but 'requires balls' so I am guessing it is something to do with either going to a modified FW40 or taking parts off of the FW41.  I reckon he would jump at a race personally, any opportunity to show he can mix it still in race conditions and I wouldn't be surprised to see him in Stroll's seat as by all accounts Lawrence Stroll is getting rather vocal about the situation so who knows what shenanigans will take place between now and the end of the season.
Title: Re: Kubica Deliberately Sabotaging Williams!!
Post by: John S on April 10, 2018, 10:53:26 PM
Maybe Lance can get his Father to buy Force India for him to try out.  :D
Title: Re: Kubica Deliberately Sabotaging Williams!!
Post by: Calman on April 10, 2018, 10:56:20 PM
Maybe Lance can get his Father to buy Force India for him to try out.  :D

OUCH!!! .. is that after the name change to Force Maple?  :D

All the best,
Cal :)
Title: Re: Kubica Deliberately Sabotaging Williams!!
Post by: cosworth151 on April 11, 2018, 02:45:27 PM
Or maybe FCA.

(Force Canada, Ay)
Title: Re: Kubica Deliberately Sabotaging Williams!!
Post by: Scott on April 11, 2018, 03:08:28 PM
Eh!  ;)
Title: Re: Kubica Deliberately Sabotaging Williams!!
Post by: Jericoke on April 11, 2018, 03:50:08 PM
Maybe Lance can get his Father to buy Force India for him to try out.  :D

There are enough Canadian companies that would fit F1.  Blackberry isn't what it was, but I think would benefit from being a larger part of F1.  Bombardier has a LONG history with the Villeneueves.  Labatt's used to sponsor F1 (they even snuck bottles of Labatt's beer onto the podium once in place of Champagne).  Burger King is now a Canadian company, shouldn't fast food sponsor fast cars?
Title: Re: Kubica Deliberately Sabotaging Williams!!
Post by: cosworth151 on April 11, 2018, 03:55:20 PM
Burger King is now a Canadian company, shouldn't fast food sponsor fast cars?

Not so loud, Jeri! Burger King has spent a fortune here in the States denying that. They keep claiming that they're still based in Miami. A lot of folks down here didn't take kindly to their big tax dodge.
Title: Re: Kubica Deliberately Sabotaging Williams!!
Post by: Calman on April 11, 2018, 08:47:15 PM
I didn't know that either!! ... Now, is there a parent company who owns Burger King and Tim Hortins, or am I getting "Murray Walker style confused" ? ... 3G Capital.

All the best,
Cal :)
Title: Re: Kubica Deliberately Sabotaging Williams!!
Post by: cosworth151 on April 12, 2018, 03:25:04 PM
Burger King bought out Timmy's, filled out the paperwork that it was actually the other way around and, bingo! Their official "tax domicile" moves from Miami to Toronto. Oddly, all of the company execs stayed in Miami. It's called an "inversion."

A few other American companies have tried it (notably Stanley Tools) but back off after threatened consumer boycotts.
Title: Re: Kubica Deliberately Sabotaging Williams!!
Post by: Jericoke on April 12, 2018, 06:13:20 PM
I didn't know that either!! ... Now, is there a parent company who owns Burger King and Tim Hortins, or am I getting "Murray Walker style confused" ? ... 3G Capital.

All the best,
Cal :)

As Cos says, legally speaking, Tim Horton's bought Burger King, except it was with Burger King's own money.  Since they are legally a Canadian company, they pay Canadian corporate taxes (which are about 10% lower than American taxes).  However, they continue to run Burger King from Miami, which means the executives pay American income taxes, which are about 30% less than Canadian.

Oh, and they get to live in Miami.

It's all perfectly legal, but you gather enough enemies that any 'savings' will be destroyed by boycotting and closer attention from tax collection agencies.

Burger King isn't alone in their chicanary:
 Ferrari is a Dutch company, and Google is an Irish company.
Title: Re: Kubica Deliberately Sabotaging Williams!!
Post by: cosworth151 on April 13, 2018, 02:52:22 PM
I used to get a Double Whooper meal several times a week. I haven't been back to a BK since they pulled that stunt.

Quote
Ferrari is a Dutch company

An inversion with Spyker?   ;)
Title: Re: Kubica Deliberately Sabotaging Williams!!
Post by: Alianora La Canta on April 15, 2018, 11:36:54 PM
Maybe Lance can get his Father to buy Force India for him to try out.  :D

OUCH!!! .. is that after the name change to Force Maple?  :D

All the best,
Cal :)

I'd suggest Force One Maple (since Force India has registered a trademark for Force One), but Bernie would probably file a protest based on the acronym...
Title: Re: Kubica Deliberately Sabotaging Williams!!
Post by: Dare on April 16, 2018, 12:49:14 AM
I used to get a Double Whooper meal several times a week. I haven't been back to a BK since they pulled that stunt.

Quote
Ferrari is a Dutch company

An inversion with Spyker?   ;)


I stopped eating them too but for different
reasons....they aren't worth a crap.  All burger
aren't the same one we enjoyed years ago. Like the
 old lady said "where's the beef"
Title: Re: Kubica Deliberately Sabotaging Williams!!
Post by: Calman on April 16, 2018, 03:19:29 AM
..aren't all take away Burgers these days, simply cardboard with brown stuff on top?

All the best,
Cal :)
Title: Re: Kubica Deliberately Sabotaging Williams!!
Post by: lkjohnson1950 on April 16, 2018, 05:14:58 AM
Nope. If you get a chance, try an In n Out burger.
Title: Re: Kubica Deliberately Sabotaging Williams!!
Post by: Calman on April 17, 2018, 06:45:42 AM
I actually now think Paddy Lowe is sabotaging Williams  :tease:

Approx. 25 seconds before the Green Light in China, it looked like Paddy was PRAYING!!! .. or momentarily fell asleep on the Pit Wall (Sky Sports Coverage)

All the best,
Cal :)
Title: Re: Kubica Deliberately Sabotaging Williams!!
Post by: Alianora La Canta on April 17, 2018, 08:08:16 AM
I'm going with "praying"... ...even my mum couldn't possibly doze off in front of 20 noisy cars!
Title: Re: Kubica Deliberately Sabotaging Williams!!
Post by: guest3164 on April 17, 2018, 08:30:42 AM
They're not that noisy these days and with sound cancelling headphones, anything is possible  :D

But I agree, more likely praying, or having a moment of quiet contemplation hoping that both drivers make it to the end, or that he can have one race without a financial backer harassing him!
Title: Re: Kubica Deliberately Sabotaging Williams!!
Post by: lkjohnson1950 on April 17, 2018, 08:40:14 AM
Stroll made a darn good start and held his own for a bit. Maybe there is some hope.
Title: Re: Kubica Deliberately Sabotaging Williams!!
Post by: guest3164 on April 17, 2018, 08:57:50 AM
Stroll races well but his qualifying seems to still let him down.  I am impressed that he is able to avoid incidents whilst making places on the first lap, it is a good skill to have.
Title: Re: Kubica Deliberately Sabotaging Williams!!
Post by: Alianora La Canta on April 17, 2018, 09:19:36 AM
Agreed. Lance is showing himself to be a better driver than last year. Sergey's not awful, but Lance is better. And both are being limited by the car they are in.
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