GPWizard F1 Forum
F1 News & Discussions => General F1 Discussion => Topic started by: cosworth151 on June 24, 2022, 03:46:11 PM
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It looks like Spa is under threat from Liberty Media. It isn't glitz enough for them.
"It is true that there was a request from F1 to introduce a greater component of entertainment," Spa-Francorchamps promoter Stijn de Boever, is quoted by Italy's Autosprint. "They said that history is something great but we need more. We decided to listen to them and follow them in the new way of offering Formula events.
"This American way, with all of the entertainment that this entails."
There is a rumor that Spa could become a non-championship round with young drivers in place of the regular driver line-ups.
Seriously, that sounds like a good way to handle the events like Miami & Vegas. Formula 1 can stay a real racing series and Liberty gets its glitz fests. The target market Liberty is trying for with events like Miami & Vegas probably wouldn't notice the difference if they raced 3 year olds in pedal cars.
https://www.autoweek.com/racing/formula-1/a40391472/spa-francorchamps-officials-prepared-to-go-the-american-way-in-effort-to-keep-f1-race/
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The American business model has long been that it's more important to attract new customers than to hold on to existing customers. Nearly all advertising involves "switch to" not "thanks for your business".
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Oh Dear!
I feared this was the way it would potentially go and Miami did nothing for me if I go to a circuit I go for the racing not a heap celeb's who know nothing about F1.
At least on TV it's able to be avoided but that also means not watching live.
I wonder what percentage of "Fans" think the same way or am I an anomaly? :DntKnw:
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I went to the British GP in 2018 and camped with family & friends from Thurs to Sun eve. Having plenty of on track action like historic cars, F2 & Porsche cup besides F1 was great, but extra things like music in the evenings, some funfair & entertaiment areas & display/exhibitions of motor/F1 related stuff, made it a whole lot better, especially for kids.
Silverstone doesn't perhaps have the razamataz of Miami but they know how to entertain the crowds for the duration.
I get a sense that Spa is a more sparse kind of affair, a bit like Brit GPs used to be back in the 70s & 80s. Brands Hatch F1 race in 1974, which was the first I went to, was certainly a petrol heads/lads convention rather than a family affair. There was only basic catering facilities and assorted team hat & T shirt sales - oh and lots of cigarette promo booths handing out fags. :D
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Liberty Wants Spa to "Americanize
All I have to say is be careful what you wish for
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Spa needs to tell Liberty Media to shove it up their collective $%^.
Spa is a historical track that hosts many other events besides the weekend that is F1 and does not need F1 to survive.
Liberty is following the American business model which has created the shitshow we all know as America today.
Nobody outside of the USA wants that business model or prevailing point of view anywhere near themselves.
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That's why, with 2 or 3 exceptions, I don't even bother looking at the listing for the commercial broadcast TV networks over here. I really have no interest in watching "celebrities" that, for the most part, I've never heard of.
On the bright side, maybe they can take tip from American minor league baseball. How about F1 races having Quarter Beer Nite or Dime a Dog Nite? (that's 25 cent beer & 10 cent hot dogs)
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Spa needs to tell Liberty Media to shove it up their collective $%^.
Spa is a historical track that hosts many other events besides the weekend that is F1 and does not need F1 to survive.
Liberty is following the American business model which has created the shitshow we all know as America today.
Nobody outside of the USA wants that business model or prevailing point of view anywhere near themselves.
Way to go Willy!
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The main think holding F1 'back' in America is the time zones. If you're an F1 fan, you'll make the time on Sunday morning to watch the race. If you're not a fan, you're not likely to casually tune it.
If you want people to tune in, you need to make it 'event TV'. As coveted as the American audience is, it's not worth giving up the larger European audience though.
I do like the general idea of a 'young guns' race though. Maybe not a whole race weekend, but perhaps a sprint (and why not include that in the WCC points?) It would make sense to make that a European race, so that shipping in extra cars/parts wouldn't be as difficult, but it seems very unlikely that having a bunch of 'nobodies' racing at 8 AM on Sunday is going to get Americans to tune in. Maybe install lights an run a rookie night race at Spa?
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America includes Canada and Mexico. North America
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America includes Canada and Mexico. North America
1) How 'dare' you lump us in with Americans!
2) You're right, Canadians get uptight pretending we're not 'Americans'. If you're from anywhere between Tierra del Fuego and Tijuana, you consider anyone living in 'the Americas' to be 'American'. It's only Canadians and people who live in the United States of America who really use the word differently. (Although I suppose it's like how we call people from Zhōnghuá 'Chinese', or when some German people show up in Pennsylvania and we just call them Dutch)
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I don't agree Dare.
While North America includes Mexico and Canada, the term "American" has been usurped by those in the USA for many years to mean "only in the good old USA".
Canada and Mexico are extremely happy to not be lumped in with anything "American", thanks very much.
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1) How 'dare' you lump us in with Americans!
My friend Sheri used to have a large collection of International Barbie Dolls. I asked her if they came with anything that the American Barbie's don't have. She said, "Yes. Health care."
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It's funny of all the countries around the World that dislike
America they never turn down the money.
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It's funny of all the countries around the World that dislike
America they never turn down the money.
I never turn money down from anyone! :yahoo: ;)
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Dutch newspaper Der Limberger claims to have seen a provisional 2023 calendar that does not include Spa or Paul Ricard. It does include tentative races in South Africa and Shanghai. Got to say the loss of Spa would temper my interest in F1 a lot. It has always bothered me that my country has such a tiny interest in history and tradition.
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Oops, forgot the link
https://www.gptours.com/gr_news/spa-paul-ricard-missing-from-2023-calendar-reports/ (https://www.gptours.com/gr_news/spa-paul-ricard-missing-from-2023-calendar-reports/)
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Dutch newspaper Der Limberger claims to have seen a provisional 2023 calendar that does not include Spa or Paul Ricard. It does include tentative races in South Africa and Shanghai. Got to say the loss of Spa would temper my interest in F1 a lot. It has always bothered me that my country has such a tiny interest in history and tradition.
My interest lessens every year. I hardly care who wins now.
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If true, that would suck but I will applaud Spa for standing up to Liberty.
I am also missing the German GP but that may be due to covid restrictions, I can't seem to keep them all straight.
I find I am less and less interested in watching new races in locations that offer a manufactured excitement for the masses.
Miami was horrible to watch and I feel a small bit of puke rising when I think of Las Vegas.
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Dutch newspaper Der Limberger claims to have seen a provisional 2023 calendar that does not include Spa or Paul Ricard. It does include tentative races in South Africa and Shanghai. Got to say the loss of Spa would temper my interest in F1 a lot. It has always bothered me that my country has such a tiny interest in history and tradition.
How can they possibly be going back to Saudi Arabia (yes, I know, $$$), surely after the drivers were effectively kidnapped to perform at the 2022 race, there will be some resistance to going back from the GPDA?
I'd miss Spa for sure, though F1 hasn't gone there every season, so hopefully it's a temporary departure. If South Africa or Shanghai are on 'real' tracks, I'm all for it. The ground effect cars seem to be best on purpose built tracks, not the street/temporary circuits we've been seeing.
As for a lack of American adherence to history/tradition, Europeans kind of obliterated American history, and the traditions they replaced it with are... best left in the past. I'm glad we're moving past that. It does make North Americans more interested in shiny/new things, but if that is our tradition, then why not?
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How can they possibly be going back to Saudi Arabia (yes, I know, $$$), surely after the drivers were effectively kidnapped to perform at the 2022 race, there will be some resistance to going back from the GPDA?
So it's fine to race in places like US, Britain, France etc with constant terrorism threats in the countries but it's not ok to race in Saudi Arabia because of terrorist activity. :nono: :nono:
The Saudi security issue was from Iran backed Yemeni rebels, now if thats not terrorist activity we'll all need a new definition in so called Western democratic states.
Also F1 authorities have never pulled the Brazil race although they regularly have on going security issues with possible & actual attacks on race personnel around the approaches to the track in São Paulo.
I'd miss Spa for sure, though F1 hasn't gone there every season, so hopefully it's a temporary departure. If South Africa or Shanghai are on 'real' tracks, I'm all for it. The ground effect cars seem to be best on purpose built tracks, not the street/temporary circuits we've been seeing.
Not quite sure how how this would work Jeri, :swoon: you seem to be implying tracks should be chosen suit the cars rather than the crazy old fashioned heritage idea in F1 that teams construct cars to suit the tracks. :D
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Dutch newspaper Der Limberger claims to have seen a provisional 2023 calendar that does not include Spa or Paul Ricard. It does include tentative races in South Africa and Shanghai. Got to say the loss of Spa would temper my interest in F1 a lot. It has always bothered me that my country has such a tiny interest in history and tradition.
My interest lessens every year. I hardly care who wins now.
Sadly we are on the same road Dare I'm usually thinking of what race to go to next and I'm really not bothered and to be honest Silverstone was the first race I have seen live or even watched for ages.
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How can they possibly be going back to Saudi Arabia (yes, I know, $$$), surely after the drivers were effectively kidnapped to perform at the 2022 race, there will be some resistance to going back from the GPDA?
So it's fine to race in places like US, Britain, France etc with constant terrorism threats in the countries but it's not ok to race in Saudi Arabia because of terrorist activity. :nono: :nono:
The Saudi security issue was from Iran backed Yemeni rebels, now if thats not terrorist activity we'll all need a new definition in so called Western democratic states.
Also F1 authorities have never pulled the Brazil race although they regularly have on going security issues with possible & actual attacks on race personnel around the approaches to the track in São Paulo.
I'd miss Spa for sure, though F1 hasn't gone there every season, so hopefully it's a temporary departure. If South Africa or Shanghai are on 'real' tracks, I'm all for it. The ground effect cars seem to be best on purpose built tracks, not the street/temporary circuits we've been seeing.
Not quite sure how how this would work Jeri, :swoon: you seem to be implying tracks should be chosen suit the cars rather than the crazy old fashioned heritage idea in F1 that teams construct cars to suit the tracks. :D
If the drivers ever collectively decided that USA, British or French tracks were unsafe to race at, and the government then forced them to race anyway, yeah, I'd support never racing there again. It's not the attack that I was worried about, any public event can be the target of terrorism, it's the Saudi government response to the drivers wanting to leave.
(For the record, I'm sure the average Saudi citizen is a great person, and that most members of the government and royal family are upstanding human beings I would be proud to call friend given the opportunity. The fact remains that the drivers were kidnapped and forced to race against their will. Why risk doing that again?)
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I still can't quite imagine me giving up on F1, but there was a time when I couldn't have imagined giving up on NASCAR the way I have. I used to look forward to going to the USGP every year. I haven't gone since 2007. There are 3 U.S. Formula 1 dates on the schedule now but I have no interest in going to a cow pasture, a car park or a carnival sideshow.
Liberty is making much the same mistake that NASCAR made. They're throwing their long time fans under the bus to attract "fad fans." They dumped long time classic venues like Rockingham & North Wilksboro for cookie cutter Charlotte clones built outside of big cities. It worked for a short time. Then the fad fans move on to the next fad but the long time fan base is gone for good.
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Couldn't agree with you more Cos.
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I used to watch everything. F1, Indycar, IMSA, Nascar, NHRA, Moto GP. If it had wheels and an engine I watched. I even watched Jet Boats. Now, I'm down to F1, an occasional Indycar, and an even rarer IMSA race. I miss it, but not as much as I thought I would. There's too much other stuff in the world and I have wide interests.
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I used to watch everything. F1, Indycar, IMSA, Nascar, NHRA, Moto GP. If it had wheels and an engine I watched. I even watched Jet Boats. Now, I'm down to F1, an occasional Indycar, and an even rarer IMSA race. I miss it, but not as much as I thought I would. There's too much other stuff in the world and I have wide interests.
Gee Lonny I'm sure glad you've stayed with F1 like the rest of us, we'd miss an old critter like you around the place. :-*
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Thanks John.
My first love was IndyCar. My Dad owned a service station. He was one of those people who was friends with everybody he ever met. He traded the Belond/AP muffler dealer for a model of the car that won the 500 in '57 and '58. I was over the moon. Coolest car I had ever seen. I followed Indy every way I could. Then in '62, I think, I was sick, tucked up in my parents' bed, clicking through the 4 TV channels we had when I stumbled across a broadcast of the GP at Spa. They seemed to have 1 camera across from the old pits. It picked up the cars out of Blanchimont, followed them around La Source, down to Eau Rouge and lost them at Radillon. The sight of those tidy little cars flashing between the trees on an ordinary country road absolutely mesmerized me. So much cooler than even Indy. I guess that's why I feel strongly about Spa. I even found Matchbox models of Clark's Lotus and Hill's BRM, which I still have. Through all the changes and drama down the years, it's still connected to those little 1500 cc beauties. But the connection grows weaker almost every year. If they fail to honor the past, the fantastic history, then it's not really my F1 anymore, is it?
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I don't get how Saudi Arabia can be on the calendar when it proved last year that it doesn't even have an eligible track for them to race at! Surely if Liberty has so much influence that it can get that much money off the organiser, it can manage to persuade them to provide a track that is actually legal?