So Bernie is innocent?!

[Monty]

Bernie won the court case. Although this was only a civil case it has a massive influence on the legal situation!

[Scott]

This one was just about whether or not F1 shares were undervalued by Ecclestone when he arranged the sale to CVC in 2005.  Doesn't mean he is innocent, in fact some things came out in this case that may affect his April court case.

http://www.theguardian.com/sport/2014/feb/20/f1-bernie-ecclestone-wins-high-court-case-constantin-medien

[Monty]

Well as you can see I did put a question mark in the heading ....innocent?
However, unless it gets changed on appeal, this will improve his legal case. The civil court found that any corruption did not favour Bernie or damage Medien.
His defence is that he was being blackmailed.
The civil case result will therefore influence the legal position in his favour

[Scott]

He was being blackmailed for tax evasion...I wonder how much sympathy he will get for that one 

[Dare]

The way I read it is the Judge says he's innocent but corrupt


Who in the world would ever think Bernie corrupt?

[Irisado]

That's my understanding too Dare.  What the judge said about Ecclestone's character and trustworthiness was damning in my opinion.  That's what the focus of the outcome should be about.  If I were a Formula 1 team principle, I wouldn't want Ecclestone to continue in his role following that verdict.

[Jericoke]

That's my understanding too Dare.  What the judge said about Ecclestone's character and trustworthiness was damning in my opinion.  That's what the focus of the outcome should be about.  If I were a Formula 1 team principle, I wouldn't want Ecclestone to continue in his role following that verdict.

I'd rather have Bernie on my side than against me...

[vintly]

I'd rather have Bernie on my side than against me...

Especially now he's best mates with Putin!

[John S]

If I were a Formula 1 team principle, I wouldn't want Ecclestone to continue in his role following that verdict.

Do you really think any team principal is unaware of Bernie's Machiavellian ways, either in money matters or power grabbing. 

The executive suits in Merc, Renault and big corporate sponsors will start any conversation about possible damage to their company's public image, if anyone does; the teams will simply follow company policy when - and if - it's handed down. 

   

[Cam]

This result has no bearing on the German matter at all.

Couple of things have always intrigued me. One, given that Gribowsky was found guilty of receiving a bribe, surely whoever paid the money is logically guilty of paying a bribe.  Two, what was the purpose of the bribe?  Gribowsky represented the bank that was buying a stake in F1.  It appears Bernie didn't want scrutiny of the way some F1 related family trusts are operated.  And if he is found to have been influencing the trusts in ways that he isn't supposed to then they are no longer trusts and he may be up for an enormous tax bill.

The German case will probably go badly for him and his F1 credibility will be in tatters, if it isn't already, not to mention the fact he turns 84 this year.  The interesting thing as always is how will CVC establish the leadership of F1 post Bernie.

As a footnote, Gribowsky was sentenced to 8 years in 2012, apparently he is already out on parole.

As a second footnote, when I spellchecked this post, it wanted to replace "Gribowsky" with "Grub"

[John S]

This result has no bearing on the German matter at all.

Couple of things have always intrigued me. One, given that Gribowsky was found guilty of receiving a bribe, surely whoever paid the money is logically guilty of paying a bribe.

I think Gribowsky agreed to plead guilty on the bribery charge so as to avoid proper examination of the alleged blackmail element, the sentence if blackmail is substantiated would be far higher than what he got. Having received money and try to hide it from the German tax authorities pretty much makes him guilty of something, but quite what is still up in the air in truth.

Any judicial system that allows presumption of innocence will be sorely tested by putting a second party on trial when the first party has been allowed to cop a plea and be sentenced for the crime without full adversarial investigation in the courtroom.

I'm not saying Bernie is innocent, however it's really hard to see how he can be offered a fair trial with Gribowsky guilty, in the legal system's eyes anyway, of accepting a bribe. Having allowed the guilty plea to bribery the court now simply has to establish beyond a reasonable doubt that Bernie paid the money, which he has already admitted he did, therefore Q.E.D.  Surely even the hippie tree hugging liberals who hate F1 so much can see the possible injustice waiting in the wings.   

         

[cosworth151]

Here in the States, it's standard practice to let the "small fish" cop a plea in order to convict the bigger fish. I had just assumed that was what was afoot here. Leverage Gribowsky into a plea and parlay that into a conviction of Ecclestone.

Cos (hippie tree hugging liberal who loves F1      )

[Jericoke]

Here in the States, it's standard practice to let the "small fish" cop a plea in order to convict the bigger fish. I had just assumed that was what was afoot here. Leverage Gribowsky into a plea and parlay that into a conviction of Ecclestone.

Cos (hippie tree hugging liberal who loves F1      )

Yeah, I'd been assuming the same thing.

Also knew they were getting in over their heads when it comes to dealing with Bernie and contracts

[Dare]

Here in the States, it's standard practice to let the "small fish" cop a plea in order to convict the bigger fish. I had just assumed that was what was afoot here. Leverage Gribowsky into a plea and parlay that into a conviction of Ecclestone.

Cos (hippie tree hugging liberal who loves F1      )

Usually when you cop a plea you don't get 81/2
years,I think it was every man for himself.


Dare[tree leaning moderate that never had
the time to be a hippie you used to love F1
a heck of a lot more]

[Cam]

Tangled web alert!   

Gribkowsky is no patsy.  F1 was dumped in his lap when Kirch went bust (after he had rejected it once before when he was with another bank). Once he realised that BayernLB (the bank he worked for) owned all the majority of shares but had no control, Gribkowsky personally took charge of challenging Bernie and attempting to wrest some control.  There were a couple of lawsuits around 2004-2005 the second of which was settled out of court and appears to have resulted in Bernie losing his spot on the board of FOH (Formula One Holdings).

In addition, Gribkowsky was party to a decision by BayernLB to purchase an Austrian bank Hypo Alpe-Adria which was a total disaster resulting in a 3.7bn euro loss to BayernLB.  Gribkowsky lost his job with Bayern over it and is currently facing criminal charges over the matter, and also, according to one report, a 200m euro lawsuit. 

Another interesting tidbit is that Bernie's trial, which opens in April, will be presided over by the same judge, Peter Noll,  who presided over Gribkowsky's trial and who in that trial described Bernie as a "criminal"

Ironically, the more I dig into it I'm starting to find Bernie's story more believable than Gribkowsky's.