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Author Topic: Austria  (Read 4831 times)

Offline Monty

Austria
« on: July 02, 2023, 04:13:33 PM »
Terrible track, terrible rules, terrible race!
….. and the dominance of Red Bull is a joke. They can pass any car at any point on any tyre  - then they disappear into the distance.
I can’t help believing that the overspend on budget caps has given them this advantage. The car is in a different league.



Offline Dare

Re: Austria
« Reply #1 on: July 02, 2023, 05:10:27 PM »
If so many cars were exceeding the track limits maybe it needs to be widened.

Only the RB of Max is running away from the pack it looks
like to me. Is Max that good or is Sergio that bad
Mark Twain once opined, "it's easier to con someone than to convince them they've been conned."

Offline Monty

Re: Austria
« Reply #2 on: July 02, 2023, 05:19:26 PM »
I think the results flatter Verstappen.
I know it was completely Perez’s fault that he lost his best qualifying time but that time was almost identical to Verstappen’s. Had he started at the front with Verstappen who knows what the end result would have been. Even with his lowly start, Perez could have (and perhaps should have) still finished second plus he held the fastest lap until Verstappen changed to the soft tyres.

Offline cosworth151

Re: Austria
« Reply #3 on: July 02, 2023, 05:32:04 PM »
Max's little stunt of diving into the pits at the end of the race to deny a single point to his team tells me everything I need to know about him. I'm sure many F1 fans were doing what I was doing at that moment - hoping for a wheel gun to fail.
“You can search the world over for the finer things, but you won't find a match for the American road and the creatures that live on it.”
― Bob Dylan

Offline Dare

Re: Austria
« Reply #4 on: July 02, 2023, 08:00:05 PM »
Max's little stunt of diving into the pits at the end of the race to deny a single point to his team tells me everything I need to know about him. I'm sure many F1 fans were doing what I was doing at that moment - hoping for a wheel gun to fail.


If he could find a way he's take Sergio's points too
Mark Twain once opined, "it's easier to con someone than to convince them they've been conned."

Offline Monty

Re: Austria
« Reply #5 on: July 02, 2023, 10:39:06 PM »
So even more penalties five hours after the end of the race. Ridiculous; and Aston Martin haven’t covered themselves in glory by protesting the original result. I think they have just put a target on their backs!
How can the FIA think it is acceptable for spectators to pay to watch a race but walk away at the end of the day still having no idea what the final result will be.
I had let myself believe F1 was improving but today has left me completely disillusioned and frankly bored with what the ‘sport’ has become!

Offline Willy

Re: Austria
« Reply #6 on: July 03, 2023, 02:50:43 AM »
A ton of whining about who got penalties and who didn't by Hamilton.
It seemed there were a bunch of unhappy drivers by the radio chatter complaint about other drivers, track limits etc.
Verstappan steals Perez fastest lap just because he can. What a dick.

Offline lkjohnson1950

Re: Austria
« Reply #7 on: July 03, 2023, 03:30:43 AM »
So even more penalties five hours after the end of the race. Ridiculous; and Aston Martin haven’t covered themselves in glory by protesting the original result. I think they have just put a target on their backs!
How can the FIA think it is acceptable for spectators to pay to watch a race but walk away at the end of the day still having no idea what the final result will be.
I had let myself believe F1 was improving but today has left me completely disillusioned and frankly bored with what the ‘sport’ has become!

One of Big Bill France's main rules when he started NASCAR was the result the fans saw before they left was the final result. Petty's last win was with an oversize motor, but it went into the record books as a Petty win. The team got no points and no prize money, but they got the win. Track limits at this track have always been a problem. Either get rid of the limits or get rid of the track.
Lonny

Offline rmassart

Re: Austria
« Reply #8 on: July 03, 2023, 09:32:31 AM »
Didn't watch the race, yet again - I am finding it harder and harder to commit my weekend to F1 races just to watch MV run away with it to the extent that he can dive into the pits to get the fastest lap.  Fair play to Red Bull for designing a beast of a car around Max, but this is killing the sport. And now they give him extra points with the sprint race.  What's the point in a season of such utter domination by one driver? I don't ever remember that happening in the 40 odd years I've been following F1. Lewis had serious competition with Nico, who won the championship while partnering Lewis. Bottas was never a threat but usually managed to put some pressure on Lewis in the first half. Schumacher at Ferrari was dominant, but he rarely won more than half the races. McLaren in '88 were utterly dominant, but it remains one of the best seasons of all time as they had the two best drivers racing for them...  This is not what sport should be about.

As for the track limits, I read in the news that there were over 1200 potential infringements and Turns 9 and 10 could not be monitored at all. Maybe disqualify the whole lot?

Offline John S

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Re: Austria
« Reply #9 on: July 03, 2023, 10:54:41 AM »
Yeah of course it's the fault of the track that drivers go outside the white lines  :crazy: - utter poppycock!!!!!

If the supposedly best drivers in the world can't keep the car inside the lines by taking it just a bit easier in said corners then they don't deserve their super licence.   :P

Yes I get it that they need to push on but surely after one or 2 track limits warnings from their team these top drivers should be able to modify their line & speed to avoid penalty.

The teams seem to be looking for an answer from the track owners when in fact they should be balling out their own drivers for not making a better job of it.  >:(

Hell if 2 drivers can run the whole race with no track limits infringements (no lap deletions) then so can the rest of the motley crew, one was Alonso not sure of t'other.

These infantile drivers are to blame for the mess in the Stewards room at the end of a good entertaining race.
1200 infringements from worlds best drivers, the same drivers who manage to navigate Monaco almost all the time without touching the walls, is a disgrace to their profession.  :crazy:

Almost everyone wanted all rules applied properly by FIA after Last race in 21.  Old motto applies 'Be careful what you wish for'.  Debacles like this from Gung Ho drivers getting penalties for crossing & re-crossing the line is one result.  ::)
Seem to recall one M. Masi was rather more lenient over track limits at places like Red Bull Ring.  :D



   
« Last Edit: July 03, 2023, 10:57:14 AM by John S »
Racing is Life - everything else is just....waiting. (Steve McQueen)

Offline lkjohnson1950

Re: Austria
« Reply #10 on: July 03, 2023, 11:24:05 AM »
On the F1 broadcast, either Palmer or Coulthard said though you can't really see it, the car is drifting on exit from 9 and 10 which makes it difficult to accurately judge how close to the line you are. Not to mention you can't really see the lines from inside the car. If they put a wall there, like Monaco, it would be an improvement.
Lonny

Offline Jericoke

Re: Austria
« Reply #11 on: July 03, 2023, 02:04:09 PM »
On the F1 broadcast, either Palmer or Coulthard said though you can't really see it, the car is drifting on exit from 9 and 10 which makes it difficult to accurately judge how close to the line you are. Not to mention you can't really see the lines from inside the car. If they put a wall there, like Monaco, it would be an improvement.

Just enforce the rule. If a car goes off track, let everyone know then and there.  Otherwise forget it.  Imagine a football game where they give you an offside call 5 minutes later, after you've been playing assuming that the previous non call was the standard, and now all the other 'close calls' you thought were the standard are now penalties too?  You couldn't play the game like that at all.

Call the infraction right away, or not at all.  If the FIA doesn't have the manpower (seriously, how hard is it to have someone watch a corner?!) to call the rules that are supposed to make the sport safe, then how can we trust they're making ANY of the sport safe?

Offline Monty

Re: Austria
« Reply #12 on: July 03, 2023, 03:40:49 PM »
In my opinion, when all but three drivers have at least one track limit penalty (and the fact that this problem only happens at one or two tracks), it is obviously the fault of the track. Easily fixed; a big sausage kerb or gravel which would slow, stop or damage the car. Then nobody would exceed track limits. They must do something to rectify this complete farce!

Offline John S

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Re: Austria
« Reply #13 on: July 03, 2023, 06:00:07 PM »
In my opinion, when all but three drivers have at least one track limit penalty (and the fact that this problem only happens at one or two tracks), it is obviously the fault of the track. Easily fixed; a big sausage kerb or gravel which would slow, stop or damage the car. Then nobody would exceed track limits. They must do something to rectify this complete farce!

Sounds easy don't it, however what you gonna do about the rest of the year when lots of other motorsport takes place on the track?
Can you close your eyes to bad injuries for motorcyclists who happen to come off at those corners, or help more amatuer/cost stapped lower series with their potentially bigger repair bills & loss of running from these changes?

Think the only plausable answer for track change is to have method of installing artificial grass, or similar slipppery surface, around the edge and be able to replace that with more solid overlay for rest of year. There's enough money and technology kicking about in F1 to come up with a solution without heavy penalties to other racing series - surely?
Racing is Life - everything else is just....waiting. (Steve McQueen)

Offline rmassart

Re: Austria
« Reply #14 on: July 03, 2023, 07:54:54 PM »
I suppose they could put a few of these just beyond track limits. Paid for by whoever runs over them.



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